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Memory Size Error and Non system disk on 5170

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Mark2000

Experienced Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2012
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85
Location
San Francisco
So I final was able to boot my 5170. On the initial memory check it gets to 3200KB (out of what should be 4736kb) and says

380000 00FF 201-Memory Error
164-Memory Size Error-(Run SETUP)

I can then hit F1 and continue. It then tries to boot from the HDD which brings up a constant Non-System Disk or Disk Error message. When I hit enter the drive tries to read with about four unsuccessful "blehs" and the gives me the same error.

Anyone know what might be going on? The drive was said to be bootable so I'm assuming it's fried? It's the original 30mb MFM drive so I'm wondering if the fools needed to park it before sending it and didn't. As for the memory, is this a setup problem or do you think a board may have come loose?
 
I see you got your multisync.

Can you boot from a floppy disk? When you do, can you then access the HD? 'Non System Disk or Disk Error' doesn't mean the disk is bad. It might mean that the geometry isn't set right in CMOS, or it's not running on the HD controller it was formatted with. If you want you can SKYPE me.

As for the memory you should run the setup program.
 
The first error message says that it sees the first 3584K and then nothing. Could be a loose/under-populated board--or a board simply configured incorrectly. Or the seller removed a board without reconfiguring the CMOS.

The "Non system disk or disk error" actually comes from the boot sector of a device. It means that either the files needed for booting are not present or the sector(s) that contain them have errors--or the drive type is misconfigured.. So technically, the drive does boot.

If you're curious as to what's on the hard disk, you might try booting from floppy and see if you see anything. Otherwise, low-level format the HD and install a new system.
 
Yup, unfortunately I don't have a boot disk, or any 5.25 disk. I'm wondering if maybe the battery is dying and loosing the settings for the memory and drive. Possible? BTW, referring to the other thread I discovered what the mystery cards are. The I/O is the memory extension. The main board has 128k and the daughter board has the other 2.5 megs. The two cards connected with ribbon cables I thought were memory extensions are actually 370 mainfraim emulators. At least that's what I think they are. It says PC/370 in them. I have no idea what to do with them.
 
Yup, you've got the S/370 emulator setup. Pretty cool is you're into that.

The PC AT advanced diagnostics floppy is pretty much a must for this--there are copies floating around. In a pinch, you can fit a 3.5" drive to your system.
 
I removed the battery all together and I'm getting the same errors. I don't know if that proves a battery problem or not...
 
Mark2000 said:
Yup, unfortunately I don't have a boot disk, or any 5.25 disk. I'm wondering if maybe the battery is dying and loosing the settings for the memory and drive. Possible?
Click to expand...
No. The battery is only necessary to retain the settings when the power is off. You can even do a warm reboot and not lose the CMOS settings with no battery. Wait, if you don't have a disk, how are you setting the CMOS?
 
I think he means the CMOS settings that were set once upon a time, rather than the settings he has set.
I'd offer to send a diags disk, but it'd take like a month and probably arrive wet :eek:

Diags disk, and possibly a replacement battery, and sounds like it'll be a nice machine.
 
SpidersWeb said:
I'd offer to send a diags disk, but it'd take like a month and probably arrive wet :eek:
Click to expand...

I'm closer than SpidersWeb so the disk wouldn't arrive wet, but I don't have a disk.
If you can point me to an image, I can make the disk and pop it in the mail (I've even got some 5 1/4" floppy disk mailers).
 
I was talking to the tech at the recycler that sold me the machine. He thinks the drive got bounced around and has crashed. He said they tested is, formatted it, and put DOS 3.3 on it.

The missing 1mb of memory is also really odd.
 
Putting DOS 3.3 on it and putting it on so that it will boot are two entirely different things and I'm not sure a recycler would always know the difference.

Bottom line -- you need to access this machine with a floppy.
 
I'm thinking I don't need this hassle with the drive. I was thinking of replacing it anyway. Is this scenario possible? Someone is sending me some AMI bios. Can I put in an IDE controller and boot from a CF card on an adapter? If so, how would I set the type 47 drive and could I format the CF to be bootable in Windows XP? I'm going to miss the hard drive noise though... Almost kills the whole nostalgia angle.
 
Sounds like a lot more "hassle" than just getting a hold of a setup diskette, not to mention that you might still need one anyway ;-)
 
You can't just put any old BIOS into a computer. It has to match the motherboard somewhat.

Beside, MikeS is correct, I don't remember a 5170 being able to access its CMOS without a diskette. It's not like some of the more modern 286s.
 
Mark2000 said:
I'm thinking I don't need this hassle with the drive. I was thinking of replacing it anyway. Is this scenario possible? Someone is sending me some AMI bios. Can I put in an IDE controller and boot from a CF card on an adapter? If so, how would I set the type 47 drive and could I format the CF to be bootable in Windows XP? I'm going to miss the hard drive noise though... Almost kills the whole nostalgia angle.
Click to expand...

In agreeance with posts above.
By the sounds of it you only need a DOS boot disk with format or sys on it, and an IBM diags disk.
Adding ROMs wont fix the startup errors, and you'd want the XTIDE BIOS which needs to be put on a ROM (you can't just throw an AMI BIOS in a NIC) which is way way more effort and you lose both value and and part of the 5170's charm in the process.

If the hard drive isn't throwing up actual hard drive failure messages or making scraping noises, then chances are it's either fine or at worst needs a low level format. Non-system disk often just means they forgot "/S" during format. As Stone said, copying and installing are different things.

I'd recommend grabbing a 5.25" drive off ebay or similar and throwing it in another PC, then grabbing a pack of 1.2Mb disks, it'll make your situation a lot easier.
 
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I'm getting the 5170 specific AMI drivers from modem7's site. They apparently don't need a disk to enter setup. A friend of mine is making a dos disk and a diag disk and coming by tomorrow night. We'll see how it turns out. You guys are giving me hope.
 
Stone said:
Not even... he could just 'borrow' the 1.2 drive in his AT for that purpose.
Click to expand...
Yes very true, it's not necessary. But it is totally worth the extra few bucks for getting things setup nicely.

Good luck Mark, I'd still recommend you leave the ROM upgrade as a last resort. But AMI do a great CMOS setup ;)
You'll need a ROM burner + a pair of 27C256's to burn the two images to (or use the factory modules, if you're confident and have a UV eraser).
 
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RetroHacker_ burned me a pair and they're in the mail as we speak. One of the things I might eventually do with machine is rip my old tape backups. I have a drive, but this is the only machine I have currently with a floppy controller. The problem will become that I don't have a drive big enough to unload the info onto (250mb tapes) I may get the ide controller, at least temporarily, so I can restore the stuff.
 
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