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Signetics PLS153A programmer

8

8008guy

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Joined
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Location
Salt Lake City, Utah
In the process of fixing a memory board for my PDP11/83 I designed a programmer for these PLDs. If anyone is mildly interested in building one let me know and I will do a write up and post everything. I use a ATMEGA1284 in the programmer.

len
 
8008guy said:
In the process of fixing a memory board for my PDP11/83 I designed a programmer for these PLDs. If anyone is mildly interested in building one let me know and I will do a write up and post everything. I use a ATMEGA1284 in the programmer.

len
Click to expand...
I am interested! Not that I have an immediate need for programming PLS153 chips, but in general programming old fuse based PROM and PLDs are interesting since all modern programmers fail to do so.
 
8008guy said:
In the process of fixing a memory board for my PDP11/83 I designed a programmer for these PLDs. If anyone is mildly interested in building one let me know and I will do a write up and post everything. I use a ATMEGA1284 in the programmer.

len
Click to expand...
Is it specific to the PLS153A or can it program the Signetics PLS100 (82S100)?
 
MattisLind said:
I am interested! Not that I have an immediate need for programming PLS153 chips, but in general programming old fuse based PROM and PLDs are interesting since all modern programmers fail to do so.
Click to expand...

Some current model programmers still support programming PLS100 and PLS153 parts. My BP Micro 1410/84 does (no longer in production but still supported) along with the current model replacements 1610 and 1710, although those are in the category of if you have to ask how much they cost new you can't afford them device programmers.
 
I need programmer for pls167a this is variation of pls105, do you have any materials online?
 
8008guy said:
In the process of fixing a memory board for my PDP11/83 I designed a programmer for these PLDs. If anyone is mildly interested in building one let me know and I will do a write up and post everything. I use a ATMEGA1284 in the programmer.

len
Click to expand...

Are you still here? I have a problem putting together an old prototype Commodore B256-80 board which needs a Signetics PLS100N. Luckily I got one, but I have no idea how to program it (and only have a fairly new EPROM programmer). So if you (or anyone else here) have a link or some material on how you built your programmer I would appreciate it. I have some ATMEGA256 boards on the shelf.
 
Kakemoms said:
Are you still here? I have a problem putting together an old prototype Commodore B256-80 board which needs a Signetics PLS100N. Luckily I got one, but I have no idea how to program it (and only have a fairly new EPROM programmer). So if you (or anyone else here) have a link or some material on how you built your programmer I would appreciate it. I have some ATMEGA256 boards on the shelf.
Click to expand...

Sorry to respond late, I just saw this. Did you ever get your device programmed?

I cant see your device listed as supported by my data io programmer.

There is a yahoo group for data io programmers, I would guess that someone has one that may support your chip. The other way would be to get the data sheet and do ir the way I did originally.

Cheers,

Len
 
The Signetics / Philips PLS100 is listed as supported by my BP Micro programmer. Does your Data I/O programmer support the 82S100? I wonder if the two parts are functionally equivalent down to the programming algorithms, with the PLS100 / PLS101 just being newer part numbers of the same 82S100 / 82S101 parts.

Anyway, I imagine it doesn't really matter for the purpose of this thread with the previous activity 1.5 years old.
 
gslick said:
The Signetics / Philips PLS100 is listed as supported by my BP Micro programmer. Does your Data I/O programmer support the 82S100? I wonder if the two parts are functionally equivalent down to the programming algorithms, with the PLS100 / PLS101 just being newer part numbers of the same 82S100 / 82S101 parts.

Anyway, I imagine it doesn't really matter for the purpose of this thread with the previous activity 1.5 years old.
Click to expand...

Ill look in the am.

Best way to grab my attention is a pm, Probably like many others....
 
8008guy said:
I cant see your device listed as supported by my data io programmer.
Click to expand...

Len,
The Data I/O Model 29B (and older Unisites) do support the Signetics PLS100 (82S100). However the 29B LogicPak needs some rare adapters. It needs the 303A-001 Signetics Programming Adapter which will do the trick if one has the needed JEDEC file or the Signetics format H&L file.

If you only have equations or a Truth Table, then you also need the 303A-101 Signetics Programming Adapter which will generate a Signetics H&L file. The file format is very similar to the programming sheet at the end of the 82S100 Spec sheet. I'm guessing a JEDEC file from an old version of WinCupl (not the Atmel version) or equivalent will also work.

Someone on the cbm-hackers site recently found a very old version of CUPL at the Purdue Math Department. Hopefully it has a full device library.
-Dave

EDIT: The library in this CUPL package is very limited and does not have the F100 device file for the PLS100. So use the Signetics Amaze package as noted in message #19.
 
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dave_m said:
Len,
The Data I/O Model 29B (and older Unisites) do support the Signetics PLS100 (82S100). However the 29B LogicPak needs some rare adapters. It needs the 303A-001 Signetics Programming Adapter which will do the trick if one has the needed JEDEC file or the Signetics format H&L file.

If you only have equations or a Truth Table, then you also need the 303A-101 Signetics Programming Adapter which will generate a Signetics H&L file. The file format is very similar to the programming sheet at the end of the 82S100 Spec sheet. I'm guessing a JEDEC file from an old version of WinCupl (not the Atmel version) or equivalent will also work.

Someone on the cbm-hackers site recently found a very old version of CUPL at the Purdue Math Department. Hopefully it has a full device library.
-Dave
Click to expand...

Yep, understand. i only have one adaptor for my series 22. I wish the adaptor schematics were available...
 
I have an EEtools TopMaxII device programmer, which can do virtually all the old bipolar fuse based devices, including the PLS1xx series from Signetics/Philips.
So I am able to program devices for someone if you can provide the JEDEC programming file.

I also have an install of DataIO EZ-ABELv4.30 that I can run in DosBox on my Win7 64b machine (or it will run native on WinXP 32b command line, it is a 16b app).

Example log file for a PLS153 device (similar architecture to PLS100/82S100, just a smaller package):
Code: 
****************************************

AHDL2PLA  ABEL-HDL Processor
EZ-ABEL 4.30 Copyright 1990-1992 Data I/O Corp. All Rights Reserved
Module: 'COMP4A'
Processing equations...
Parsing test vectors...
Writing vectors to comp4a.tmv...
Module parsing complete. Generating logic equations...
Creating reduced sum-of-products on-set matrix....
Creating ABEL-PLA file comp4a.tt1...

AHDL2PLA complete - 0 errors, 0 warnings. Time: 2 seconds

****************************************

PLAOPT  ABEL PLA Optimizer
EZ-ABEL 4.30 Copyright 1990-1992 Data I/O Corp. All Rights Reserved

Input file: 'comp4a.TT1'.
UC Berkeley, Espresso Ver. 2.2, modified by Data I/O Corp.
Group Reduction...
Reading PLA comp4a.TT1...
Running PLA optimization...
Writing PLA format to comp4a.TT2...
Execution time = 1 sec.
Group results in 'comp4a.TT2'.

PLAOPT complete.  Time: 0 seconds

****************************************

PLASIM   ABEL PLA Simulator
EZ-ABEL 4.30 Copyright 1987-1992 Data I/O Corp. All Rights Reserved

PLA file: 'comp4a.TT2'
Vector file: 'comp4a.tmv'
Building model...
Simulating PLA...
.......................................................................
.......................................................................
.......................................................................
...........................................

256 out of 256 vectors passed.
Simulation results in 'comp4a.SIM'.

PLASIM complete. Time: 1 second 

****************************************

FUSEASM    Fusemap Assembler
EZ-ABEL 4.32 Copyright 1990-1992 Data I/O Corp. All Rights Reserved

Input file: 'comp4a.TT2'
Device: 'F153'
Choosing best polarities...
Mapping equations...
38 of 42 terms used; 256 vectors loaded
Programmer load file: 'comp4a.jed'
Generating report...
Report file: 'comp4a.LST'

FUSEASM complete.  Time: 1 second 

****************************************

JEDSIM   ABEL JEDEC Fusemap Simulator
EZ-ABEL 4.30 Copyright 1987-1992 Data I/O Corp. All Rights Reserved

JEDEC file: 'comp4a.JED'
Device: 'F153'
Building model...
Simulating model...
.......................................................................
.......................................................................
.......................................................................
...........................................

256 out of 256 vectors passed.
Simulation results in 'comp4a.sim'.

JEDSIM complete. Time: 1 second 

****************************************

And lastly, I also have my older EETools TopMax programmer which is the prior parallel-port based version of the TopMaxII (which has a USB interface). It is still perfectly functional, but it requires a WindowsXP machine with a real parallel port to be able to run the EEtools MaxLoader software (www.eetools.com). I'm willing to let it go to a good home to someone that can make use of it. Original cost was $495 years ago, I'll give it up for $100 plus shipping.

Don

PS: EEtools TopMax has been claimed.
 
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dave_m said:
Yes, I agree, Schematics would be good. The little programming adapters are getting impossible to find. It took me several years to find one for the Intel 8048 uC family.
Click to expand...
And when they do turn up, Some sellers think they are made of gold and want a fortune for them, Great programmers but yes the adapters are getting harder to find.
 
Regarding PLS100 / 82S100 parts, the F100 diagram on page 43 (page 57 of the PDF) of this Data I/O manual has the fuse number map that is missing from the datasheets.

Logic Diagram Package, 981-0251
www.bitsavers.org/test_equipment/dataIO/981-0251_ProgrammableLogicDiagramPackage_Sep90.pdf

That part is simple enough that, if necessary, logic equations for the part could be hand translated into a JEDEC fuse map without finding any software with a fitter for that part. For OTP parts it might be good to get someone else to double check your work before burning a part.
 
Al Kossow said:
I dug up a few old Signetics PLD DOS programs (simpal and amaze) yesterday
ULed to http://bitsavers.org/components/signetics
Click to expand...

Excellent. I'll have to try running those some time to see how they work.

From a quick look at the Amaze_1.7 files it appears that the supported device list includes the following:

Code: 
PLS100    PLS103    PLS105    PLS151
PLS153    PLC153    PLHS153   PLUS153
PLS155    PLS157    PLS159    PLS161
PLS162    PLS163    PLS167    PLS168
PLS173    PLUS173   PLS179    PLC473
PLHS473   PLHS18P8  PLUS405   PLHS501
PLC16V8   PLC20V8   PLUS16R4  PLUS16R6
PLUS16R8  PLUS16L8  PLHS16L8  PLUS20R4
PLUS20R6  PLUS20R8  PLUS20L8  82S115
82S123    82S129    82S131    82S135
82S137    82S147    82S181    82LS181
82S183    82S185    82HS187   82HS189
82S191    82HS195   82HS189
 
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