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Acquired a ][...

D

Drken

Experienced Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2009
Messages
306
Location
Charlotte NC
I recently acquired a small lot of Apple ][+ systems and, to my pleasant surprise, there was an Apple ][ in the lot, serial number 3884. There is a small article with photographs available on www.Apple2Online.com if anyone is interested in seeing it. Anyway... the system boots fine but there is a video problem: the black screen is filled with wide vertical white bands. I have gone through all the various documents I have about troubleshooting the ][, swapped every chip as directed, and still nada - exact same problem.

Anyone ever see that kind of video output before? If so, do you know what I can try to resolve the problem? Bear in mind that I'm neither an electrical engineer nor a google geek.

Ken
www.Apple2Online.com
 
What you have is a very early Apple ][+ with an Apple ][ cover. The serial number would start "A2S1" for an Apple ][, yours starts "A2S2", correct for a ][+. The label would be black or red for an Apple ][, yours is green. Still, the lowest serial number ][+ I've seen.

It's likely a revision 3 or 4 motherboard, looks like the keyboard may be original. The motherboard has a full set of Applesoft roms on it, correct for a ][+.

An Apple ][ with serial number 3884 would have been made in late 1977 or early 1978, not summer of 1979. My Apple ][, serial no. A2S1-22365, was manufactured in March (11th week) of 1979, your ][+ is week 31.

It's possible that the early Apple ][ plus didn't have a separate badge, so it might even be the right cover... anyone know for sure?
 
Last edited:
I have a lower numbered IIplus and it has the correct badge for the cover.

regards,
Mike W.
 
My Apple II has a serial of 15XXX and was made in early 1979. The power light was raised like the early models so I'm surprised yours is not. Did Apple raise them, lower them, raise them again, and lower them again? :whatthat:
 
dorkbert said:
err... password locked pdf...?
Click to expand...

I can get to the document, but it comes up as a series of blank pages in my browser.
If I attempt to open it from there with Adobe Reader, I get the error message that Adobe Reader cannot decrypt the file.

smp
 
The PDFs on A2OL are ONLY locked for editing, not for opening/reading. You're most likely either trying to open it for editing or using an earlier version of Adobe Reader. Try updating your reader to the latest & make sure you're only trying to read the document, not open it with editing enabled.
 
Thanks, all, for the helpful albeit confusing comments. The way Apple Corp. dealers would swap components makes this all the harder, and then folks themselves over the year would swap ROMs and other components.

Is there a good source for the serial number labels?

Ken
www.Apple2Online.com
 
Drken said:
The power light IS raised on mine. Sorry that didn't come through on the photos.

Ken
www.Apple2Online.com
Click to expand...
It doesn't appear to be raised on yours which makes sense based on your Apple II+'s mobo date (I didn't see it earlier). As HoJoPo mentioned, you have an Apple II+, not an Apple II based on the A2S2 serial number and motherboard. Only the top case is from an Apple II which is pretty strange but I guess not unheard of.
 
Thanks, everyone, for the helpful feedback. I'd not seen a motherboard with the very dark green slots (forgot to mention that in my online description of the system) - I've seen the light green and black slot connectors, but never such a dark green - nor that specific motherboard, but I do not have any experience with a ][ and very little experience with a ][+, which is what I first bought in 1980 and my memory of it is foggy to say the least. So it seems like I have a very early Apple ][+ system, correct?

Let's see... I have a ][ lid, so now I simply need to get a ][ motherboard, ][ base pan, ][ keyboard, ][ power supply unit and the rest of a ][ case and I'm all set! Easy-peasy!

Ken
www.Apple2Online.com
 
If all you want is to experience an Apple ][, get a set of Integer BASIC ROMs and swap them in, or use the ROM card. I put a genuine Apple 16k/language card in my ][ to get the autostart ROM (aftermarket cards usually don't have the ROM), keeping the Integer ROMs active. The only problem is that this makes BASIC.SYSTEM useless, as there is no Applesoft for it to patch (thought I haven't tried loading Applesoft into the language card in DOS 3.3 and then rebooting with PRODOS....) DOS 3.3 works fine though. :)

The dark green slots with the ears seem to be common on 1979/early 1980 motherboards, as both my early 1979 ][ and early 1980 ][+ have these style slots. The ][ is a revision 3, the ][+ is a revision 4 motherboard, the revision is printed next to the slot 4 connector on them, and is also printed under the 6502 CPU.
 
Drken said:
Let's see... I have a ][ lid, so now I simply need to get a ][ motherboard, ][ base pan, ][ keyboard, ][ power supply unit and the rest of a ][ case and I'm all set! Easy-peasy!

Ken
www.Apple2Online.com
Click to expand...

Actually, you could build a ][ using the Integer ROMs, and change the label to "A2S1-3XXXX" (and color to red instead of green). You'd have a clone of a mid-1979 Apple ][, since they made the ][ and ][+ at the same time for a while. All the other parts are the same....
 
Years ago I read that during the transition time from II to II+ there were some parts interchanged. You would have II+ with older keyboards, II's with newer lowered power lights, and even II+ with II lids, not uncommon. The sticker on the bottom tells what it was sold as. As far as I know, they never sold a IIplus with a II motherboard since that was the main difference. I've personally owned II's with older and new keyboards and I had a II+ that had the raised power light and one that had the keyboard with the built on encoder. Looks like this is what you have. The keyboard you have is the early version before they went to separate board for the encoder. The keyboard is actually a little less common than most II+ keyboards.
 
The II Plus was introduced in June 1979, but the II wasn't discontinued until 1981, so during that time, the II and II Plus were sold side-by-side, at the same price. If you wanted Integer BASIC and the Mini-Assembler in ROM, you got the II. If you wanted Applesoft BASIC in ROM, you got the II Plus.
 
HoJoPo said:
The dark green slots with the ears seem to be common on 1979/early 1980 motherboards, as both my early 1979 ][ and early 1980 ][+ have these style slots. The ][ is a revision 3, the ][+ is a revision 4 motherboard, the revision is printed next to the slot 4 connector on them, and is also printed under the 6502 CPU.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that info, as it is quite helpful for me. I looked at Slot 4 and all I could see was "REV" with the slot connector itself covering the rest of it. I did lift the CPU out and it is indeed a "4" board, so I appreciate that info.

I was disappointed at first, but knowing that it is an early ][+ is still pretty exciting (to me, at least). Still an nice addition to my personal collection, for sure!

I am starting to wonder if the "Apple ][" cover is indeed the original since with this unit being so early (#3884), maybe Apple used some ][ covers for those first ][+ units.

Ken
www.Apple2Online.com
 
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