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Amiga Prices

Please no FPGA vs. software emulation nonsense. There are almost perfect software emulators and very sloppy FPGA implementations, too. Arguing this way simply does not work.

Accept it or not, but the only difference between an FPGA (hardware emulation) and software emulation is how you describe the hardware you clone. With an FPGA, you describe its logic, whereas with software emulation, you describe its behaviour. Both can be done well or badly, no matter what method you choose.
 
I kind of wondered when those PPC Amiga boards were being made in small batches why somebody didn't just use a G4 Mac and just port the OS to it and save a grand or two. You could always emulate the custom chips and put them on a PCI card in the mac if needed.

For the most part I enjoyed messing around with Amigas because I got into it when it was at the absolute low in resale value of the classic hardware. These days people want a grand for an Amiga 1000 that is very limited in what it can do.
 
TBH it kind of surprises me that people who travel between the US and Europe don't tend to bring this type of stuff with them if the prices differ greatly?
Like put an eBay or Craigslist ad stating that the computer is only for pick up at a specific hotel or airport at a very specific time span.
I brought back a Sinclair Spectrum +2 to the states I bought in London because they are unobtanium here. Not because they are expensive, just rare to find in the wild.

funnily though, I found a Sinclair 48k relatively local to me (maybe a 2 hour drive) that the guy posted for pickup only shortly after we returned back home, nevertheless contacted the seller to plead my case for shipping it to me (I am sure it would have fit comfortably in a flat rate shipping box) and he unceremoniously told me to piss off... he delisted the item right after that, didn't even give the opportunity to drive to pick it up after that. Really rude guy.
 
Woah! Haha! I forgot about this post. I might purchase an Amiga, if I decide on it. Thank you all for the info.
 
I hope you have used Amgia Forever to test out the Amiga scene before going for the real hardware. Sometimes, an affordable Amiga will sneak through the auction sites but all the interesting add-ons can become very expensive. Find out that you will like Amiga a lot before really opening the wallet.
I found this out the hard way when a Mac accelerator I was looking for turned out to work for the Amiga too. Basically, if a piece of hardware is useful to the Amiga community, kiss goodbye to your chances of ever seeing it for a reasonable price.
 
I found this out the hard way when a Mac accelerator I was looking for turned out to work for the Amiga too. Basically, if a piece of hardware is useful to the Amiga community, kiss goodbye to your chances of ever seeing it for a reasonable price.
Amiga hardware or anything related to it is crazy overpriced. It's practically a daylight robbery.
 
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Amiga hardware or anything related to it is crazy overpriced. It's practically a daylight robbery.
You're not wrong. I remember picking up a pair of stripped A1200 tower conversion cases at a surplus auction thinking about getting back into Amiga, then when I realized I was missing way too many bits, I decided to put the works on eBay hoping to at least recover what I had into the pair. Did I? And how! About 8 times the nominal amount I had into them, that's what!
 
You're not wrong. I remember picking up a pair of stripped A1200 tower conversion cases at a surplus auction thinking about getting back into Amiga, then when I realized I was missing way too many bits, I decided to put the works on eBay hoping to at least recover what I had into the pair. Did I? And how! About 8 times the nominal amount I had into them, that's what!
Yeah, they're daylight robberies. If I ever see a good condition cheap amiga I will impulse buy it.
 
I found this out the hard way when a Mac accelerator I was looking for turned out to work for the Amiga too. Basically, if a piece of hardware is useful to the Amiga community, kiss goodbye to your chances of ever seeing it for a reasonable price.
Is that true for newly created hardware too?
I get that collectible items that also have "usage-value" are sought after.
But in comparison, are there any modern hardware created for other computers with somewhat comparable specs to the modern combined graphics card and "everything extra" (can't remember the details, perhaps it has USB, network and/or disk interface) that are cheaper?
Although on one hand it's a lot of money for that card as compared to similar spec 15 year old PC hardware that goes for almost nothing, but the price is on par or lower than what the vintage Amiga graphics card cost back in the days (at least adjusted for inflation).
 
I've always fallen back on that Amiga hardware is expensive because the community is insane.
P R E A C H. Amiga people are the weirdest weirdos of the retrocomputing world. I think the brand getting passed from owner to owner in the 90s will-they-won’t-they-ing the future of the platform fried some of the hardcore original users’ brains, so now you have people who keep trying to pretend it’s a modern full-caliber daily-driver OS. I don’t want to use YouTube on an Amiga, and if I have to run modern fully-custom hardware to do it, what exactly is the advantage over just using my MacBook? I got Ubuntu’s Unity DTE running on top of Arch on my main ThinkPad in the 2010s, I have proven my worth and paid my dues. Sometimes the mountain isn’t worth the climb.

I love the Amiga, I think it’s THE 16-bit platform, and in a just world the Atari wouldn’t have split the market and the IIGS would have just been a Mac, but that didn’t happen, and there are people out here paying serious cash to keep pretending like 1994 can be re-rolled. AND THATS NOT TO MENTION trying to charge money for firmware for a computer released forty years ago. Come ON.

I am very, very lucky to have a semi-local Amiga group (the North Texas AUG, I don’t remember their official name, it’s fairly informal) who are super welcoming and just happy to have new people into the thing they like, and who have been nothing but helpful—and who have given me frankly crazy deals on a CIB A500 and A1000. It seems like most of the original/older/core members already have their machines upgraded to the maximum, and now they’re content to talk about the stuff with new people. I honestly haven’t found much real hostility online, either, so things may have cooled off in recent years, but the vibe on, say, Amibay, still feels like it’s got some real ugliness lurking beneath the surface that I don’t associate with the broader retrocomputing community.

To be fair, also, the Amigans obsession with upgrades means there are more and cheaper options for processor upgrades than any other retro platform. If you want to accelerate an Apple IIGS, which you really need to as the later OS revisions start to get pretty heavy, you have to find rare, expensive period hardware, of which there are only three options, and they usually need to go to the shop before they’re ready to go. Meanwhile, there are six different FOSS accelerator/RAM/IDE driver boards for the A500 alone, and another couple modem closed-source ones.

Anyway, here’s your soapbox back, I think I’ve had my turn. 😅
 
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The A500 was just fine playing floppy games with no upgrades.

The Apple IIgs is slow with GS/OS and to get the most out of that you need an 8MB RAM card, SCSI storage (or equivalent) and a CPU upgrade and you still get a slow Mac experience but still fun. Using a IIgs as an Apple IIe substitute it works just fine.
 
Well, insane (reasonable?) pricing has a pretty wide range for hobbyists in every genre. Been to classic car swap meets before? Same vibe.

Nevertheless I was over the moon last year when I bought a pristine condition Amiga CD32 *AND* SX-1 expander for $200 local to me! An absolute bargain.

If you want to see really insane people, look no further than the Steve Jobs worshipping Apple fans. There was an auction recently at a Sotheby's type place where several artifacts that were supposedly owned by Jobs himself sold for crazy high prices... like, one of those rainbow ribbon cables with a cutoff end "this came from THE Apple I" for like $20k. Talk about crazy.
 
The A500 was just fine playing floppy games with no upgrades.

The Apple IIgs is slow with GS/OS and to get the most out of that you need an 8MB RAM card, SCSI storage (or equivalent) and a CPU upgrade and you still get a slow Mac experience but still fun. Using a IIgs as an Apple IIe substitute it works just fine.
Oh yeah... the IIgs's floppy disk performance was like the equivalent of a C-64 with no fast load cartridge. haha
 
The IIGS is proof that the C65 wouldn't have been successful even if launched five years earlier, and to waste time designing and making prototypes of it in the early 1990s was totally bonkers and the sign of a dysfunctional company.
 
It's understandable that Apple essentially dropped the IIGS to focus on the Macintosh.

At the same time it could have served as a bridge to a successor that dropped hardware support for Apple II software and focused on utilizing the 65C816 in a purely 16-bit environment.

That might not have made any sense for Apple, but it would likely have had some appeal to a significant part of their userbase at the time.
 
At the same time it could have served as a bridge to a successor that dropped hardware support for Apple II software and focused on utilizing the 65C816 in a purely 16-bit environment.

That might not have made any sense for Apple, but it would likely have had some appeal to a significant part of their userbase at the time.

Sixteen bit computing was always just going to be a stopgap measure; this was something everyone knew going back to the 1970's. The 65C816 never made even a little bit of sense as a desktop computer CPU considering how late it came out, this idea that the IIGS ever would have rated a more "serious" successor is just ridiculous. Yes, it would have made some hard-core Apple II forever nutballs happy (except those guys would never have been onboard with the "dropping support for Apple II software) if Apple had churned out a "IIGS+" of some sort with SIMM sockets/a 4x faster CPU/higher resolution graphics/whatever, but this was always a dead end. This was ultimately the Apple II successor that outfits like schools and whatnot with big fleets of Apple IIs probably really wanted/needed, but in the end it only filled a narrow gap before even the lowest-end Macintoshes were powerful enough to run a fully software Apple II emulation anyway.

It's always rankled me a little bit when you have people trying to say the IIgs was a better machine than the Mac (the specific machine you'd compare it to would be the Mac Plus, I suppose) because it was "in color". Okay, sure, I guess it is. But everything else* about it is worse. Maybe I'm just bitter for having to do desktop publishing on a CGA card for a few years back in the 80's, but I'm sorry, 640x200, even in color, absolutely sucks compared to square pixels in monochrome for anything "serious", and the Mac will also run rings around an unaccelerated IIgs.

(* Okay, the IIgs has a nice sound chip too.)

The IIGS is proof that the C65 wouldn't have been successful even if launched five years earlier, and to waste time designing and making prototypes of it in the early 1990s was totally bonkers and the sign of a dysfunctional company.

It is extremely weird, isn't it? In mid-80's there was definitely this trend of when the big players in the 8-bit market saw the writing was on the wall for their legacy platform they'd end up releasing one final swan song version which incorporated basically all the most popular wish-list items that users thought they wanted. Notable examples of this are, of course, the Apple IIgs, the Tandy Color Computer III... and the Commodore 128. Commodore already had the Amiga, they were dipping into the PC compatible market, the C128 was obviously intended as that "one last one for the road" for the C64 faithful. Sure, they'd keep selling these things as long as people were buying, but clearly it was for all practical purposes over... but then suddenly it wasn't again?

The only reason I can possibly think of for why they decided to strike up the band again was there was that little period in the latest 80's/early 90's where 8-bit machines that were clearly dead everywhere else in the world were briefly selling like hotcakes in lower income parts of Eastern Europe and they thought they could clean up against... uhm, a weird motely collection of Sinclair and Amstrad clones, their own C64, and the old-stock Plus/4s still leaking out of warehouses? How they might have thought that was a battle worth winning escapes logical analysis.
 
Well, insane (reasonable?) pricing has a pretty wide range for hobbyists in every genre. Been to classic car swap meets before? Same vibe.

Nevertheless I was over the moon last year when I bought a pristine condition Amiga CD32 *AND* SX-1 expander for $200 local to me! An absolute bargain.

If you want to see really insane people, look no further than the Steve Jobs worshipping Apple fans. There was an auction recently at a Sotheby's type place where several artifacts that were supposedly owned by Jobs himself sold for crazy high prices... like, one of those rainbow ribbon cables with a cutoff end "this came from THE Apple I" for like $20k. Talk about crazy.
$200 is a really good price for any sort of Amiga! That is a really good deal! I agree with you that Apple fans are really insane. They list items for absurd prices, for example some of the Apple IIs and Macs on eBay being listed for upwards of $300, it is insane that people would list those machines for that price.
 
The start of IIgs serious development was about the same time as the initial burst of Mac sales had slowed. Hedging against the prospect that the Mac was about to be yet another unsuccessful GUI computer makes sense to me. Now, continuing on to release after the Mac 512 showed up as something useful may not have been as prudent especially since Apple prevented the IIgs from being a viable alternative to the Mac. The IIgs hardware looks like it should have been capable of a high resolution monochrome mode. Being more focused on internal competition than external may well be the defining characteristic of 1980s computer companies.
 
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