McLevier, early sythesizer based on PDP-11/23

[willyk]

Anyone remember or know anything about these? I have some notes where I and some others from the info-pdp forum tried
to help Graham Birmingham get one running. There is a general description at this link: http://www.synthmuseum.com/mcleyvier/
The web site above suggest only about 8 were produced.

Graham gave us some hardware details on the one he was working on 10 years ago:
"My location is Toronto for those who would like to know. The equipment
involved here is a PDP-1123, M8186, with an M8059KF memory board, an M8043
serial board, a Peritek VRG-Q video board, a DTC host adaptor with a DTC
520 disk controller with a Seagate ST-506 operating system hard disk and a
second one as the data/files drive. There is also a 5 1/4" floppy drive.
The trick with this set up is that the serial card talks with a custom
interface card which in turns talks with the terminal, music keyboard and
external serial ports.
"
We had some trouble doing standard DEC diagnostics such as using ODT because of the graphics display which I had never heard of,
but eventually got past that by using a standard rs232 terminal connected to the M8043. Anyone ever hear of the DTC 520 disk controller?
Sounds similar to the RQDX, but I think I never found any documentation for it.

I ask because someone emailed me from UK saying Laurie Spiegel has the remains of a Mclevier in the NYC area. He wonders if its possible to
recover data from its ST-506 drives, or even get it running. Can anyone recommend a data recovery company (preferably on east coast) that could non-destructively try to recover data from the MFM drives?

It an odd ball enough project that it sounds interesting to me...

 

[commodorejohn]

Hrm, I initially figured you were referring to the original-model Synclavier, which was also based on an LSI-11 system, but holy cow, there were two PDP-11 synthesizer systems? Whaddya know. I'm gonna have to look up some of Laurie Spiegel's recordings, I'm interested to hear what the thing sounds like.

As for recovery, do you have any idea if the drives work? If so, it should be a fairly simple matter to just boot the thing into RT-11 from a TU-58 emulator and dump the disk over the serial port - I've backed up my own 11's hard disk this way. If the computer doesn't work but the drives look good, I'm sure any DEC enthusiast would happily volunteer to try dropping them in a working machine for the purpose.

Also, please tell me someone is preserving the system and not just the disk contents. This thing sounds like an awesome beast, it'd be a shame for it to wind up scrapped.

 

[commodorejohn]

If anyone's interested, there are recordings of some of Spiegel's McLeyvier pieces here. Interesting stuff, almost sounds like primitive FM synthesis in some ways.

 

[willyk]

Mcleyvier, a little more info

Mcleyvier, a little more info

PDP Synth enthusiasts, sorry I inadvertently lied to you. After posting above I did
a google search for the disk controller and found:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/vmsnet.pdp-11/gj2-JsOXlwg/3BeiryZ-bAsJ
This mentions that Alan Frisbie worked on one of these in 1995. It says the
system ran RSX-11M v3.2 and the DTC 520 was not an RQDX clone, but used a custom driver.
After reading this I reviewed my notes further and found I had talked to Alan about this.
He had a lot of useful comments. Anyone know how to contact him now? Flying-Disk.com no
longer seems to exist.

Anyway I find I have manuals which I was probably sent by Alan or Graham for both the DTC 520
disk controller and the Peritek VRG-Q graphics display in my archives. Alan believed the version of
RSX11 run on these machines had been hacked to allow the direct use of the VRG-Q board for display
and the the original sources were long gone. He was kind enough to send source code for the RSX11M driver
for the DTC 520. He was converting the system he was working on to use
RL02 drives as the ST-506 MFM drives were erratic.

 

[AteEm]

PDP Synth enthusiasts, sorry I inadvertently lied to you. After posting above I did
a google search for the disk controller and found:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/vmsnet.pdp-11/gj2-JsOXlwg/3BeiryZ-bAsJ
This mentions that Alan Frisbie worked on one of these in 1995. It says the
system ran RSX-11M v3.2 and the DTC 520 was not an RQDX clone, but used a custom driver.
After reading this I reviewed my notes further and found I had talked to Alan about this.
He had a lot of useful comments. Anyone know how to contact him now? Flying-Disk.com no
longer seems to exist.

Anyway I find I have manuals which I was probably sent by Alan or Graham for both the DTC 520
disk controller and the Peritek VRG-Q graphics display in my archives. Alan believed the version of
RSX11 run on these machines had been hacked to allow the direct use of the VRG-Q board for display
and the the original sources were long gone. He was kind enough to send source code for the RSX11M driver
for the DTC 520. He was converting the system he was working on to use
RL02 drives as the ST-506 MFM drives were erratic.

WOW!!
What a small world story. I know Alan from way back in the mid '80s. The company I worked for had just purchased a color matching system that ran on a 11/73 under RSX11M; I ended up expanding the memory and adding some Fujitsu drives and serial ports to turn it into a company wide system. I brought Alan in as a consultant and he continued to do work for that company until recently (a couple of years ago). He was the go to guy for RSX...his car license plate was RSXGURU!
Hmm, I think those Fujitsu drives were ST506...and I do recall some flakiness....wonder if it was the same system:shocked:

Anyway, the last number I had for Alan is 323-254-8442, but I haven't talked to him since the mid to late '90s.

 

[Marty]

Hi All;
On a slightly same but different note, I used to have an Altair 8800, that was used by Bruce Cichowlas of ARP Instruments for a Synthesizer that He was designing, I Don't know How far He got in the project.. As when I got it, It had some Homemade Boards and many Pages of Software that He had used for Developing His System.. But, they were mainly Operating System software, and Very Little Synthesizer stuff.. It had the listing for His operating System and an Assembler by MicroTec, which I think was Processor Technology based.. It was mostly Cassette based, but had the Rudiments of using the Altair Disk Drive..
I had to sell it to pay rent and bills, so I don't have it any more, but I made copies of all of the Documents, that had come with it.. I think it went to a good home, but I don't know for sure..

THANK YOU Marty

 

[AlanF]

Blast from the past -- McLeyvier, RSX, VMS, and dying company

Blast from the past -- McLeyvier, RSX, VMS, and dying company

WOW!!
What a small world story. I know Alan from way back in the mid '80s. The company I worked for had just purchased a color matching system that ran on a 11/73 under RSX11M; I ended up expanding the memory and adding some Fujitsu drives and serial ports to turn it into a company wide system. I brought Alan in as a consultant and he continued to do work for that company until recently (a couple of years ago). He was the go to guy for RSX...his car license plate was RSXGURU!
Hmm, I think those Fujitsu drives were ST506...and I do recall some flakiness....wonder if it was the same system:shocked:

Hi Mike, Alan Frisbie here.

That color matching system has been sitting in one of my storage units since it was retired in 1999. One of these days I'll figure out what to do with it.

Bits of your old software are still being used, after many years of my additions and porting to VAX/VMS and then Alpha/VMS. Sadly, the company was sold to an investment group about five years (as if you didn't know that), and has been going downhill ever since. I left about a year ago and the VMS system has been running on autopilot ever since. I don't think the new IT manager can even spell VMS, since all he knows is Windows.

The McLeyvier I worked on in 1995 belongs to John Leimseider, who is now working at a museum in Calgary. He contacted me last year about a project to replace the old ST506-style drives with something more modern. He still has the RL02 drives I put on the system, but is afraid to use them due to a lack of any spares. Our plan is to replace the ST506 drives with a MFM emulator and SD chips. I already have the boards, but have not had time to do much more. One of the problems to solve is what CRC algorithm was used by the DTC disk controller. DTC also used 1024 (or was it 2048?) byte blocks instead of 512, so that's another issue. None of this will stop us, but it might slow us down.

Fortunately, I made backups of everything on the original McLeyvier disks, and still have copies on my Alpha/VMS system, on tape, and on RL02 disks.

I have retired and my current effort is disposing of all the vintage computer stuff in my four(!) storage units. If anyone likes, I can post a list on the forums, or e-mail it to you.

There is no web site for Flying-Disk.com, but e-mail can be sent to me there using my last name @ that domain. The phone number mentioned above also works, but you'll have to talk to the answering machine -- we never pick up the phone unless we hear the voice of someone we recognize.

 

[AteEm]

Hi Mike, Alan Frisbie here.

That color matching system has been sitting in one of my storage units since it was retired in 1999. One of these days I'll figure out what to do with it.

Bits of your old software are still being used, after many years of my additions and porting to VAX/VMS and then Alpha/VMS. Sadly, the company was sold to an investment group about five years (as if you didn't know that), and has been going downhill ever since. I left about a year ago and the VMS system has been running on autopilot ever since. I don't think the new IT manager can even spell VMS, since all he knows is Windows.

The McLeyvier I worked on in 1995 belongs to John Leimseider, who is now working at a museum in Calgary. He contacted me last year about a project to replace the old ST506-style drives with something more modern. He still has the RL02 drives I put on the system, but is afraid to use them due to a lack of any spares. Our plan is to replace the ST506 drives with a MFM emulator and SD chips. I already have the boards, but have not had time to do much more. One of the problems to solve is what CRC algorithm was used by the DTC disk controller. DTC also used 1024 (or was it 2048?) byte blocks instead of 512, so that's another issue. None of this will stop us, but it might slow us down.

Fortunately, I made backups of everything on the original McLeyvier disks, and still have copies on my Alpha/VMS system, on tape, and on RL02 disks.

I have retired and my current effort is disposing of all the vintage computer stuff in my four(!) storage units. If anyone likes, I can post a list on the forums, or e-mail it to you.

There is no web site for Flying-Disk.com, but e-mail can be sent to me there using my last name @ that domain. The phone number mentioned above also works, but you'll have to talk to the answering machine -- we never pick up the phone unless we hear the voice of someone we recognize.

Holy necro post!
Good to hear from you, Alan. Yeah, I've heard, too, that N-M is tanking. Given the way everything was 'handled' it doesn't bother me in the least.
I'm still putzing around with my 8/m, but likely will never run TSS/8 unless I cave to an emulated RF08. Booted up the 8/a you arranged for me to get many years ago.
Sounds like you're still in the LA area; Hilda and I were just wondering if you'd retired and moved.
Anyway, take care!

Mike

 

[AlanF]

Sounds like you're still in the LA area; Hilda and I were just wondering if you'd retired and moved.

Retired, but still in the same house since 1985. I have so much vintage computer stuff (and a ton of books)
that the idea of moving fills me with dread. But that probably applies to almost everyone on this forum!
I briefly considered moving to the Seattle area so I could help at Paul Allen's Living Computer Museum.
But when visiting the area last year, I found the traffic to be as bad as Los Angeles! Also, while I like the
idea of a wetter climate than So-Cal, that part of Washington is a bit *too* wet for my taste.

I have embarked on an endeavor to scan my entire collection of manuals for Bitsavers, which will allow me
to get rid of at least one storage unit. I am almost done with the DEC-compatible hardware manuals, and
will then move on to the DEC manuals. It will probably take Al several years to post-process them all.
He still hasn't gotten around to some that I scanned long ago, but after seeing his work area at the museum
I can understand why. He needs some minions to take over some of the load.

Alan

 

[m_thompson]

Hi Mike, Alan Frisbie here.

I have retired and my current effort is disposing of all the vintage computer stuff in my four(!) storage units. If anyone likes, I can post a list on the forums, or e-mail it to you.

I have 1985 DECUS cassettes. I think you did a presentation on disk drives?

Please post what equipment you would like to dispose. Some of us are still in the collecting phase.