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Getting a parallel ZIP 250 to work (DOS)

evildragon said:
As long as you guys have a working Zip driver, it doesn't really matter which terms I use.. I use the word "hack", as I went about not using guest.ini... I do not believe Iomega allows renaming guest.ini to other things to disable it on purpose.. If they do, then I'm wrong..

But you guys have a working all-set driver now, something that wasn't figured out until now, as to why it wouldn't go through...
..
Click to expand...
As long as it works, I'm not complaining.. but to be honest I thought I tried this (as far as it is in the readme, as mbbrutman says). But I'll try it again :)
Am I right that you tried this on a PS/2 Model 30?
Because I am trying to get a 5160 XT to work with it.


evildragon said:
EDIT: Sorry if I seem a tad cranky.. It's because I have been racking my brain on what was causing the problem, all day long... I'm quite tired and need my rest now, seeing an XT reboot a hundred times a day is boring..
Click to expand...
I know THAT feeling... !
 
Jorg said:
As long as it works, I'm not complaining.. but to be honest I thought I tried this (as far as it is in the readme, as mbbrutman says). But I'll try it again :)
Am I right that you tried this on a PS/2 Model 30?
Because I am trying to get a 5160 XT to work with it.



I know THAT feeling... !
Click to expand...

I have tested it to work on a Model 25... Mine has the NEC V30 CPU, but I am confident it will still work with an 8086 or V20...

Also, as my 25 is classed as an XT machine, it should be the same and work on yours, as you have the same amount of RAM I do...

If it haults again, let me know where it's getting stuck on you...
 
Zips are one of my favorite 'cheats' for putting the equivalent of hard disk storage on an old machine. Guest.exe works on even a PCjr, but it takes up quite a bit of memory on an old machine.

There is a device driver called 'PalmZip' which is much smaller, but works even on DOS 2.1. Unfortunately, PalmZip is very slow with the parallel port access. But for replacing floppies on a system, it's hard to beat. The author of PalmZip asks for something minimal, like $10 to $15 US. Hard to beat.
 
evildragon said:
I have tested it to work on a Model 25... Mine has the NEC V30 CPU, but I am confident it will still work with an 8086 or V20...

Also, as my 25 is classed as an XT machine, it should be the same and work on yours, as you have the same amount of RAM I do...

If it haults again, let me know where it's getting stuck on you...
Click to expand...

Yes, I'll post it here.. at the moment I am lookng for the easiest way to get your zip file to the XT, my current mainboard just supports one floppy so I had to disconnect my 5,25"...
 
evildragon said:
I have tested it to work on a Model 25... Mine has the NEC V30 CPU, but I am confident it will still work with an 8086 or V20...

Also, as my 25 is classed as an XT machine, it should be the same and work on yours, as you have the same amount of RAM I do...

If it haults again, let me know where it's getting stuck on you...
Click to expand...

Be aware that the parallel port on a PS/2 Model 25 (or any PS/2 actually) was designed to be bidirectional (closer to modern systems), whereas a "standard" parallel port of the XT era will not have the same capabilities. To say "XT class" for the 8086 versions of the Model 25 and 30 is a little bit misleading, because they have enhancements to take them quite a bit above an XT (and were marketed as replacements to the XT). What level of LPT card is Jorg using?
 
My PCjr has a bi-directional parallel port. If you have the right card on your XT, I can point you at the docs to make it bi-directional too. :)

It's a great upgrade for using things like Zips and parallel port Ethernet and SCSI adapters on standard parallel ports.
 
IBMMuseum said:
Be aware that the parallel port on a PS/2 Model 25 (or any PS/2 actually) was designed to be bidirectional (closer to modern systems), whereas a "standard" parallel port of the XT era will not have the same capabilities. To say "XT class" for the 8086 versions of the Model 25 and 30 is a little bit misleading, because they have enhancements to take them quite a bit above an XT (and were marketed as replacements to the XT). What level of LPT card is Jorg using?
Click to expand...

Basically I wanted to try the parallel port that comes with the installed full lenght MDA videoboard. I guess this means they don't come any older....

But now you mention it, I might try some add on cards I have lying around to see if that makes a difference.
 
Jorg, have you been able to use a Zip 100 before? If you can/have, then the Zip 250 should work as far as communications goes..
 
evildragon said:
Jorg, have you been able to use a Zip 100 before? If you can/have, then the Zip 250 should work as far as communications goes..
Click to expand...

I have a zip 100, but that is IDE...

But back when I fiddled with the 250, I read somewhere that a ZIP100 works with an XT, but a ZIP250 does not. Can't remember why though..
 
It probably was because of the auto-detection scheme by the default driver crashing the computer, as Zip 250 takes those types of .sys files...

I think the SCSI driver is the one that crasehes an XT..

Oh, and if you need to get more space out of it, you can delete all in the IOMEGA folder, EXCEPT: Guest.exe, ASPIPPM2.SYS, and NIBBLE2.ILM...

Those are the used files..

I think this also works better than having Guest.exe do all the work.. See, the problem with Guest.exe is it's autodetection.. It fails on an XT machine. However, if I load the driver into config.sys, as from Guest.ini, but with debugging information enabled (to aid in what's going on), Guest.exe's only purpose is to assign a drive letter, instead of doing that, AND detecting the drives..

And btw, Guest.exe always says that it's finding a drive letter, even before it started drive detection, so it's status is false..
 
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Allright, I tried, but it does not work.

It seemed I was already pretty thourough last time, as there were already 5 different driver version (including palmzip) on the harddisk :).

I tested the lpt port- its explicitly reported as: bidirectional: NO.
So that might be the problem.

I found on 8 bit card I can try, and several 16 bit that might work in 8 bit.
But they all got a LOT of jumpers....

Duh.. maybe next weekend..
 
I thought the Nibble mode got around the bidirectional issues..

You could try the Byte.ilm file and edit that into config.sys, but I don't know if that'll work..

I'll need to get my hardware book out and read up on this again...
 
Jorg said:
Well, it just says 'NO UNIT DETECTED' too
Click to expand...
Hmm, weird.. I'll look up some stuff and see what I can come up with...

Atleast at this point, some "semi-XT-----like an IBM Model 25/30", can handle a Zip 250 now...

I might have to "truly" hack up a driver to work.. But do check a different LPT card if you can, one that is bi-directional...

EDIT: My hardware book does state that Nibble mode allows single-direction ports to take input using the status registers.. It "should" work.. There might be something up with your port, or a conflict... Does the port work at all when a printer is used?

EDIT2: You did put the settings in Config.sys, correct? And did it show the Iomega Fast Parallel Port Interface Manager screen?

EDIT3: I don't think my Model 25's printer port is bi-directional, as I can't run BYTE mode, which would be for bi-directional stuff.. I get a "Adapter Not Present"...
 
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Try this one, this is the last possibly one that should work...

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/GUEST.zip

It uses NO config.sys entries, so remove anything my previous one installed to config.sys... This one uses only guest.exe, and loads only the correct driver, alone with the lowest speed setting, making it the most compatible..

The above is also Guest 6.0...
 
evildragon said:
...I might have to "truly" hack up a driver to work...

...EDIT: My hardware book does state that Nibble mode allows single-direction ports to take input using the status registers.. It "should" work.. There might be something up with your port, or a conflict... Does the port work at all when a printer is used?...

...EDIT3: I don't think my Model 25's printer port is bi-directional, as I can't run BYTE mode, which would be for bi-directional stuff.. I get a "Adapter Not Present"...
Click to expand...

"Nibble" mode is much slower (and on different signal lines), and the code has to know how to handle the port in those cases. Does the interface itself specify a bi-directional parallel port as required? And trust me, all of the PS/2s had bi-directional parallel ports, to improve the interface and to be able to use IBM's provided "Data Migration Facility": http://www.gilanet.com/ohlandl/floppy/Data_Migration_Facility.html
 
IBMMuseum said:
"Nibble" mode is much slower (and on different signal lines), and the code has to know how to handle the port in those cases. Does the interface itself specify a bi-directional parallel port as required? And trust me, all of the PS/2s had bi-directional parallel ports, to improve the interface and to be able to use IBM's provided "Data Migration Facility": http://www.gilanet.com/ohlandl/floppy/Data_Migration_Facility.html
Click to expand...
I know nibble is slower, according to my book, it uses the status lines to provide 4-bit data input... The Zip drive's supposed to use that if you don't have bi-directional ports.. Byte.ilm IS to be used if you do, but mine don't work, it just doesn't receive the signal from the Zip drive, wheras on my 286, it does...

Unless somethings wrong with my model 25, I can't get above anything but nibble mode...

I have a newer Model 25 motherboard, so I'll have to test that one.. it's still an 8086 class model...

EDIT: I used mbbrutman's utility, and this is what it came back with.. I also used another utility and it calls my 25's parallel port "4-bit"..

http://blackevilweredragon.spymac.com/standard.jpg
 
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I swapped the old parallel port (which was NOT on the videocard, as there is CGA in it now) but had an old National? IC on it, and the text (c) 1985.
Replaced it by a more modern looking 8 bit I/O card with SIS chip.
Still non bidirectional though.
Now the driver in config.sys sees the zip drive: ZIP 250 :)

But if I start guest.exe, it hangs forever at 'trying to find a drive letter for your zipdrive'

edit: BTW: I use IBM PC-DOS 3.30
 
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The code for the utility that ED used is copied below - other people should try it on their systems, just to make sure it's not bonkers. (I trust the code, but never say bugs are impossible.)

Code: 
100 REM Parallel port detection
110 REM Michael Brutman (mbbrutman@yahoo.com), 2002-12-02
120 REM
130 REM Do a few simple tests to see if a parallel port is
140 REM available, and if it is a standard parallel port or
150 REM if it is a bi-directional PS/2 parallel port.
160 REM
170 DEFINT A-Z:REM Declare our variables to be integers.
180 DEF SEG=0: REM Set base segment to 0 so we can look at BIOS areas.
190 REM
200 CLS:PRINT "Scanning up to 4 parallel ports":PRINT
210 FOR L=0 TO 3
220 REM
230 REM Get a port address from the BIOS.
240 P=PEEK(&H408 + (L*2)) + (PEEK(&H408 + (L*2) + 1) * 256)
250 IF P = 0 THEN PRINT "Port number" L "not found.":GOTO 440
260 PRINT "Port" L "found at port address: " HEX$(P)
270 REM
280 REM Put suspected port in output mode
290 I = INP(P + 2):OUT P + 2, ( I AND &HDF )
300 REM Test for presence of port: Test is performed twice
310 OUT P, 174
320 IF INP(P)<>174 THEN PRINT " Parallel port not detected or broken":GOTO 440
330 OUT P, 67
340 IF INP(P)<>67 THEN PRINT " Parallel port not detected or broken":GOTO 440
350 REM
360 REM Try to put the port in PS/2 mode (bi-directional)
370 I = INP(P + 2): OUT P + 2, ( I OR &H20 )
380 OUT P, 75
390 IF INP(P)<>75 THEN PRINT " Port is a PS/2 bi-directional port.":GOTO 440
400 REM Try again with a different value, just in case it is a coincidence.
410 OUT P, 223
420 IF INP(P)<>223 THEN PRINT " Port is a PS/2 bi-directional port.":GOTO 440
430 PRINT "Standard (not PS/2 bi-directional) parallel port found at " HEX$(P)
440 PRINT:NEXT L

The page that describes the parallel port modification to make it bi-directional can be found here:

http://www.brutman.com/PCjr/parallel_port.html
 
This thread is fairly PC specific, so it is being moved ...
 
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