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Need Help To wakeup my apex plus 8088-1

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nesan

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Apr 12, 2009
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Need Help To wakeup my apex plus 8088-1
My Epson made Apex plus gone dead for the firs time when I switch on it after long time in garage. When I on it the first time it boot up and memory check boot logo and displayed. Hardware problem. I forget exactly what it said. But I heard a un usual sound “crack…”. I opened the box and found battery seems leaked. I removed the battery and other cards. And try to boot again. What the hell happened it dose not boot. No floppy sound neither hard disk. Only power led lit. Nothing else. No post code or beep code. I suspect the Bios might have corrupted. Check the voltages in ISA slot ok. I removed the bios it was phoenix ver 1.0. I put the bios in my another system. To see if it has any thing to show me. The other pc was phoenix bios v2.5. I do not know if it will work. I expect some movement. But nothing. I do not want to try the Phoenix v2.5 to the dead apex plus because feared to loos my other pc. What can I do? Could anybody help me to solve this problem?
If some one have Phoenix v1.0 bin could you please give me a copy.
Thank you
nesan:(
 

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That isn't much to go on.

Where was the battery when it leaked? Did any of the battery electrolyte get onto the motherboard or any other component?

Have you measured the voltage from the power supply when it attaches to the motherboard?

Are any components, particularly capacitors, burned or deformed?

I would avoid doing anything with the BIOS until you are certain that everything is electrically correct.
 
Yes I checked the voltage. And traces. No damages. The PC stop working before I touch anything except remove the other cards. I will attach the test video Please have a look on it. I used a debug card with 4 digit indicator according to phoenix bios first two digit shows FF means board is alright but rest two digits shows – it mean no activity. It shows data bus activity. Other than that all the voltages are ok reset signal ok clock ok, no frame activity. IRDY keep lit.

I checked with another phoenix board first two digit shows FF second two shows 06 this mean initialising system hardware. This phoenix Ver2.5. The previous one is Ver1.0

http://www.teck-v-met.com/download/Apex plus.WMV
 
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No
I do not have any other Bios Except my Another PC’s Phoenix Bios V2.5. But it is in working order I do not want to take a chance to get troubles with that. But I had tried the Bios from this Apex plus to the other working Pc with no any thing in screen, No beep code, no post code. I have a question will it give any hops try any 8088 bios with this pc?

If any body can post me a bios file I can ask Mr. Andrew Lynch “Senior member” in this form to burn it for me. He is a Nice person.
 
Are you complete the circuit still with the battery removed? You can do a simple test on ICs by usually checking for voltage on pin 1. As the more professional folks will tell you this won't let you know that the IC is really working but it will let you know if it's dead or not getting power.

Most crack noises I can think of would be a capacitor or fuse. Capacitors are not uncommon to fail especially in a garage environment. I'd suspect maybe the battery was already leaking and the crack you heard was elsewhere, but that's just my guess.

Check the caps around the processor and power supply (be very careful and don't touch them though! This is where people can get killed if you become the circuit. You can discharge them yourself with an insulated handle screwdriver and touching both leads of the capacitor together. This also can create a loud pop noise as well so be ready/warn the girlfriend/wife heh.

- John
 
For those who may have a BIOS for this system, it was marketed in some parts of the world (i.e. USA) as the Epson Equity I.

You can find a User's Manual here. The same ftp has a lot of information on Epson deisktop models.

Are the BIOS part types the same on the systems that you're trying to swap with? In other words, you aren't trying to get a 27128-resident BIOS to run in a system with a socket for a 27256, are you? It would seem to be impossible to hurt a BIOS by plugging it into another working motherboard.
 
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nesan said:
Electrically I checked all parts seems ok. The bios I swapped is From Dead Apex Phoenix V1.0 bios "D27128A" to Working Phoenix V2.5 bios "M5L2764K-2". I forget to say one thing The RLL card also gone dead. It had some corrosion trace just close to the Data side ISA socket. I am Attaching Photos.
Click to expand...

Well the difference in the EPROMs accounts for your problem in swapping them--the 2.5 BIOS is in an 8KB EPROM, but the 1.0 is in a 16KB EPROM. Not the same at all--and not socket-compatible. The good news is that you probably haven't ruined the chip by experimenting.

The corrosion on the RLL card doesn't look too bad. I wouldn't do anything to it until the motherboard is working again.
 
I notice thet it was 8k. I never try bios swapping before. I expect at least some activities in PC Debug indicator. But it showed me the same post code FF - -. Is there any other way you suggest me to confirm. the Bios status.
Thank you for the link you gave me in previous post it may be really usefull for me.

The RLL card I tried with working 8088. But it failed to work. I remember the crack sound I heard is when the pc attempt to start the HDD. I hope so.
 
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It doesn't sound good if both the RLL card and the motherboard don't work. Have you tried any of the other cards you had in the Apex to see if they work?
 
Why? are you suspecting the Chip may have problem? me too it could be the transceiver may be buffer. I replace the CPU with new and Identical one. So it can't be cpu. I am using the video card to my 286 system. It works AVGA card 16bit. there was a modem that's all it had. the floppy is integrated one.


http://www.teck-v-met.com/Apex/ApexPlus.JPG
 
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Yes, this is a difficult one. If this were my system, I'd be looking at expected signals with an oscilloscope to find a bad component.

Do you own an oscilloscope or a logic probe?
 
what a coincident I was thinking about it. But I forget the signals and timing of 8088. Moreover my oscilloscope is analog two channel one. I left my logic probe in Europe bad luck.if you guide me I can go on it. by now oscilloscope is a good idea. I hope I may get my Logic probe in a couple of weeks. I hope my multimeter have logic probe too. Wow yes it has. I can connect it to PC to record the signals. but I do not know where is the Software. I have to search it.
 
Sometimes a "crack" can also be a logic IC exploding. This happened to me after I turned on an Apple IIGS whose motherboard had been acidified by battery acid. A small IC flew to pieces on the memory expansion board.

Check all ICs very carefully with a magnifying glass.

Tez
 
I checked all the components under microscope no such a damage visible. I thing I better try using Oscilloscope and test probe to narrowing the defect. referring my old books to start test any information is appreciable.

Wow tezza I Visit your classic PC collection. It is amazing. It is really nice to see those PC in such a condition in 2009. Keep it on your collection.
 
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You've already checked the voltages.

I'd probably start by checking out the signals at the 8088 pins. For example, is RESET (pin 21) low? Is HOLD (pin 31) low? Do you see a clock signal at pin 19? Do the states of S0-S2 (pins 26-28) indicate that the 8088 is running? Look at the output signals of the 8288 bus controller. Is ALE wiggling?

I'm sure you get the idea. The problem could be something very simple, such as a bad 8288 or 8284.
 
Pin19---4.77Mhz
Pin21---Low
Pin31---Hi
Pin26 & 28---Hi

I do not find Bus controller 8288 IC. I thing the

"FARADAY
FE2010A
M92H601"
I am no sure This is the bus controller FARADAY FE2010A PC Bus & peripheral controller for XT
http://www.teck-v-met.com/Apex/ApexPlus.JPG
 
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The good news is that the FE2010 has a very complete datasheet, including a reference design on datasheetarchive.com. There is also a good 8088 datasheet on alldatasheet.com.

The FE2010 essentially combines the functionality of the 8284, 8288, 8237, 8259 and 8254 into one package, as well as a keyboard interface. If the problem is with this chip, you might as well scrap the board as it's going to be very difficult to find a replacement.

(My mistake on pin 31 -- it is not HOLD in maximum mode on the 8088. Pin 31 high is normal.)

Can you look at the data and address lines on the 8088 to see if it is running? Do pins 24 and 25 change state?
 
Wow Something interesting That is a wise catch Chuck(G). And I am shame to say you that I did not think about this before. I forget almost about 8088. I got the data thanks for it. Even the FE2010 is faulty, I can get it for a good price from china. In my work place, I have all the facilities to replace this finepin Jlink IC.

The Logic I got
Pin 24 --LOW
Pin 25---LOW ------ ALE Should be High to Activate Latch
Pin 26---High ------ DEN Should Go Low To Activate the Data transceiver

Am I right? Correct me if I am wrong.

Pin 24 for what?

I Believe Little progress...:p
 
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