I found this too on the forums. Great, a wild goose chase. I would be so mad if this ends up broken or destroyed somehow, if the sell pattern continues. But either way, if mactwiggy was a really determined collector he should have just gave it to a musuem or let them use it for display.
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Mac prototype I just acquired today
- Thread starter mactwiggy
- Start date
I found this too on the forums. Great, a wild goose chase. I would be so mad if this ends up broken or destroyed somehow, if the sell pattern continues. But either way, if mactwiggy was a really determined collector he should have just gave it to a musuem or let them use it for display.
NeXT
Veteran Member
Like said before, the current $100000 seller is a douchebag in Maple Ridge and he has a very bad reputation around my parts as such and because he has a problem with hoarding.
It's a real letdown that the system ended up in his hands. The system really belongs at the Computer History Museum in Mountain view. It's really just too rare and valuable to belong outside of a museum.
It's a real letdown that the system ended up in his hands. The system really belongs at the Computer History Museum in Mountain view. It's really just too rare and valuable to belong outside of a museum.
I didn't know the guy that has it now is a hoarder, his eBay name is "wozniac" I believe. It deserves to be in a musuem. If we can gather up enough money, maybe we all could buy it and give it a home that it should be in.
RWallmow
Veteran Member
Not worth it at 100k, I would think even 10k would be hard to round up in donations to get it in a museum. Just not THAT many people in the vintage-computer hobby. Only way I see this guy getting over 10k is if he hits the maybe one or two collectors with that kind of money, or Apple (or the real Woz) themselves buy the thing (FYI, I doubt the real Woz would want it, he was fairly hands-off in apple by the time the Macs were coming about, his bag was the Apple II's, find a uber rare II prototype, and you might spark his interest ;-).I didn't know the guy that has it now is a hoarder, his eBay name is "wozniac" I believe. It deserves to be in a musuem. If we can gather up enough money, maybe we all could buy it and give it a home that it should be in.
RWallmow
Veteran Member
Is this the guy who used to trade on ebay as "MapleRidgeAuctions" or something like that? I had some dealings with that guy, seemed like a possible hoarder, but seemed decent enough and friendly, but that may have just been because I was giving him money for a few mac portable parts for one that I was restoring.
RWallmow
Veteran Member
Per Person, yes I believe its only one, however legally registered companies I believe can have multiples, so he might not be breaking any rules with multiples if he has a company setup. Plus I doubt epay gives a crap as long as he pays his bill :-/ (which would be substantial on 100k, lol).
NeXT
Veteran Member
It is.
His prices have always been horrible. As mentioned elsewhere he's really only in it for the money.
His prices have always been horrible. As mentioned elsewhere he's really only in it for the money.
MikeS
Veteran Member
I wonder what the guy who originally sold it cheaply because he thought it was going to someone who'd appreciate it is thinking when he looks at that...
Scumbags...
Scumbags...
Lorne
Veteran Member
Then you would believe incorrectly.
It's more like one per email address - I know some who have three Ebay accounts, each with a different email address/credit card attached to the account.
Not a bad idea when it takes just one moron looking for a no reason refund to screw up your feedback, and there appear to be plenty of those morons out there.
DOS lives on!!
Veteran Member
I absolutely despise people who get stuff from people so cheaply because the original owner thinks it's going into better hands, then turn around and show their real character by doing something stupid with it. And that's why when I got my complete XT system for 70 dollars, the guy knew he was giving it away for so little money, but he knew that I wasn't going to sell it or do something else foolish with it. And for him trusting me is the exact reason why I see the true value in trust and why I'm not going to sell this XT and use it for it's intended purpose.
Same thing with typewriter-art people, it burns me when they take the round keys off them and use them for some (so called beautiful) artwork. Then just turn around and trash the typewriter.
I helped a lot of people with the money I got from selling it to the current owner. Especially my parents, who are so poor (dad on disability, mom unable to find anything but minimum wage part time work for going on 3 years) they had been going to a food bank in order to help feed themselves until I sent them some of the proceeds for this. I also helped a local couple with travel expenses to take their son to a specialist doctor for treatment. Don't think I'm some rich person, I barely scraped together the $500 I paid for it to buy it. Sorry if some of you have trouble with me making a profit off an old guy who was keenly aware that it was worth much more than he sold it to me for. Someone else can let it collect dust on their shelf for the payout I got.
RWallmow
Veteran Member
Yeah, someone had told me that, hadn't researched it myself, but I'll take your word on it.
twolazy
Veteran Member
I smell something, I know that smell... smells like bull shit. Your last sentence sums up your sentiments. You took advantage of an old man, for a profit. Misguide yourself in thinking you did it to help others some more... And here's a bozo button for your efforts! If you really were such a great person, you give that original owner a cut, which you have not. Speaks volumes about you. Hope you feel great about yourself. Karma will eventually catch up.
olePigeon
Veteran Member
To be fair, I would have sold it, too. However, before I'd sell it, I'd attend several MUG meetings to let people check it out in person. I'd then put it on loan at the Computer History Museum in Mountain View for a few months.
After that, I would then have put it on Christie's or Sotheby's in a high profile auction, with 10% of the proceeds going to the Computer History Museum. If someone's willing to bid $100k on eBay, you could easily double that (or more) with a good high profile international auction. After the sale, I'd gift $13,000 to the original owner. Not an arbitrary amount, it's the maximum to avoid being taxed and wouldn't muck up his social security.
After that, I would then have put it on Christie's or Sotheby's in a high profile auction, with 10% of the proceeds going to the Computer History Museum. If someone's willing to bid $100k on eBay, you could easily double that (or more) with a good high profile international auction. After the sale, I'd gift $13,000 to the original owner. Not an arbitrary amount, it's the maximum to avoid being taxed and wouldn't muck up his social security.
chalackd
Experienced Member
I'm finding myself quite disgusted with the attitudes around here over this. Yeah, so somebody got something for cheap and sold it for a profit, it happens every day. A lot of you need to stop kidding yourselves that this old guy (original owner) was just some ignorant fool that got completely ripped off, I'm sure he knew that he had something valuable, and I'm sure he knew that the chances of it going on the market were pretty good. He made a choice to sell it as he did, and that's just the risk he chose to take. He could have chose to try and sell it like the current owner is, but perhaps he just didn't care about the hassle, and didn't want to be sitting on it for months/years waiting for a sale. Maybe people should just accept it for what it is, and take relief in the fact that as long as it's in the hands of somebody who values it so high it's not about to go to scrap, it could have just as easily have ended up in an estate from an old guy passing away, and been thrown in the trash by an executor who just thought it was nothing more than another junky old computer.
Honestly, this display is making this place look like it's full of stuck up elitists, where if you aren't just passing your rarities onto other collectors for free, or donating your goodies to museums, you're just some kind of evil prick. God forbid anyone try to make a profit in this capitalist society of ours.
If I would've seen a disappointing display like this before joining up I probably would've just continued on my way and found somewhere not so rude to participate in. (Though I know from hanging around that people here aren't really like this, so I don't know why it's such a problem this time...)
Honestly, this display is making this place look like it's full of stuck up elitists, where if you aren't just passing your rarities onto other collectors for free, or donating your goodies to museums, you're just some kind of evil prick. God forbid anyone try to make a profit in this capitalist society of ours.
If I would've seen a disappointing display like this before joining up I probably would've just continued on my way and found somewhere not so rude to participate in. (Though I know from hanging around that people here aren't really like this, so I don't know why it's such a problem this time...)
I don't see the problem in reselling items (as long as you didn't say it was intended for a non profit museum when you got it). You will see some bad feelings between long term hobbysists and people who just want to flip something for a quick buck. People change over time and some eventually leave the hobby so their stuff needs to be sold or given away depending on what the owner feels like doing at that time.
Computer collecting hasn't been around long enough to have dedicated museums with endowments where anything rare you send them will more then likely be well kept for the rest of time for others to see.
Computer collecting hasn't been around long enough to have dedicated museums with endowments where anything rare you send them will more then likely be well kept for the rest of time for others to see.
MikeS
Veteran Member
As a matter of fact he did apparently indeed know that it was valuable, and one of the reasons he sold it relatively cheaply was that he believed that the buyer was a collector who would "appreciate it" when in fact it was the buyer's intention all along to turn it around and make a (presumably substantial) fast buck. Some of us find that kind of deception disgusting and try to avoid dealing with people like you and the buyer(s) in question who don't see anything ethically wrong with it.
Many people in this hobby give things away or invest their time freely to help or benefit fellow collectors/hobbyists knowing full well that they could make (more) money with it; of course they know that the recipient can do what they want with it but unlike you some people don't think it's right to just turn it around and sell it for a profit (ask Hargle ;-) )
You see the same thing in the Freecycle movement (or even in sending relief supplies overseas); people offer things for free in the hope that it will go to someone who will appreciate it as they did or benefit someone in need, but as they see more and more of their well-intentioned gifts just making someone rich instead they tend to become more cynical, to everyone's loss.
But like the Steve Landon/AppleIIfan discussions, it' s interesting what it tells us about the ethics of some of the people commenting...
Interesting that you would have judged this entire forum and its members on this one thread alone...
FWIW I have no problem with people selling things for whatever they think it's worth and as some regulars will know I've in fact often ranted in their defence, so to speak, but that's not the issue here.
DOS lives on!!
Veteran Member
That first sentence completely cancels out the last sentence. Telling us that we're rude and chastise people like this, then say that we aren't like that. (As the old saying goes, don't judge a book but it's cover.) And you just did that big time.
Guys I just saw on eBay it had one bid. I agree that he should have sold it, but not unless the seller knew first, then try and make us feel bad about his pity story which may be true, but if he would have sold it himself he could have got the 99,995. Seems to smell bad. Really bad.