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Problem with CMS upgrade on a rev0 CT1350

K

keropi

Experienced Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2012
Messages
195
Location
Ioannina , Greece
Hello!

Thanks to Chuck(G)'s amazing work I managed to get 2 gals with the program (thanks to the community-helping member DK) in order to upgrade my 2 rev0 CT1350 cards.
I installed the gals, the 1099Ps and removed the CMS-OFF jumper. Tested with Paku Paku and Monkey Island and CMS works fine! :D
BUT :(
the moment you install the cms upgrade you lose the SB functionality. Another member in VOGONS had this problem and I decided to test more extensively my system. (see vogons thread HERE )
For this purpose I am using my IBM PS1/pro pc and mainly Alone In The Dark game... the computer and game(s) work fine with another SB model installed or a 1350B rev0 without the csm upgrade.

Here is what I found:

With the CMS upgrades fully installed does not even get detected in alone in the dark.
  • if you use a previous sb config and just enter the game then all you get is sb sfx. FM is dead. you cannot enable it at all.
  • if you remove the gal the cards gets detected and sfx/music works but the 1099Ps make noises, one needs to remove them too.
  • messing with the DMA sharing jumper makes no difference... also tried with the 12/13 jumpers (no dice - they just enable/disable sb/fm) and J14 that hanhs the pc when it is removed and you try to use the sb in any way.

I also tried with Eye of the Beholder III setup program, it does see the SB part but complains there is no FM part for the midi. (needless to say both games are originals without any cracks or funny stuff running)

Is there any solution to this problem? could it be that rev0 cards need another GAL program?
thanks for any info/tips! :D
 
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Hello all,

I have the same problem too.. Its very strange..

I have also upgraded it with CMS chips and programmed GAL..

Iam also tested with PAKU / CMS then i got sound FM and FX
When iam starting the game with PAKU / ADLIB the game works, but the sound is dead on FM and FX too..

Because a limit of games i have here, i also tested it with THE CHALLANGE; Winter games..Released by accolade made by mindspan..
PC speaker is working fine.. When i tried Adlib, it couldnt detect the card.. If iam using soundblaster.. It couldnt detect my card too.. But when iam setting only the FX part on soundblaster, i have got FX sounds, but the FM music part is dead as mentioned above in the first post..

I also tried the 2 driver packages, the older and the new one i guess.. It comes with testing software..

The first package have TEST-SBC.EXE. If iam using that one, it detects the whole card settings, and can testing the sound.
Both FX and FM music is working then..

When i tried the second package, and it comes with DIAGNOSTIC.EXE.. Then it can detect my card settings. BUT when iam want to test the sounds, the whole system is frozen.. Then i only can reboot again..

So it looks the CMS could be working, and soundblaster FX is working

The whole Adlib / Soundblaster FM part is just dead..
 
Well, sorry to see this happen. The SB board I used (as well as the upgrade PAL) was what I worked from. As I no longer have either, there's little that I can do to help. But here are some thoughts:

It could be that there are different versions of the upgrade PAL--or different ways the PAL socket is wired. I did make use of the way the socket on the borrowed one was wired to get at the result, but it could be that not all revs are wired the same.

Dunno--as it stands, I can't really figure out anything as I no longer have the board.
 
thanks for replying Chuck(G) !
I have 2 rev0 boards and I can spare one to science :D , but would it be enough to figure out why it won't work when I don't have an original GAL?

this is the board btw...

vcykvp.jpg
 
About the best I can do is take the rev0 board and my work and see if there are any inconsistencies. If you want to give that a try, I'm game for it.
 
Well, funny you should ask--I just struggled a bit with my programmer today (turned out to be a bad cable--doh!).

I burned a NS GAL16V8 and tried it and it works fine. I note that you're using a Lattice GAL16V8D, using my JEDEC file for the 16V8. That might be the fly in the ointment--I did verify that your fuse map matched mine. However, that doesn't tell us if Lattice goofed around with the fuse meanings. I'll probably have some sort of answer this week.

Programmable logic can be like networking or SCSI--Voodoo. :)
 
Chuck(G) said:
Well, funny you should ask--I just struggled a bit with my programmer today (turned out to be a bad cable--doh!).

I burned a NS GAL16V8 and tried it and it works fine. I note that you're using a Lattice GAL16V8D, using my JEDEC file for the 16V8. That might be the fly in the ointment--I did verify that your fuse map matched mine. However, that doesn't tell us if Lattice goofed around with the fuse meanings. I'll probably have some sort of answer this week.

Programmable logic can be like networking or SCSI--Voodoo. :)
Click to expand...

HMMM... I also tried burning a Lattice GAL16V8B for my CT1350B rev 0. Couldn't get it to recognize the CMS upgrade either. I was able to use the Lattice chip for the "1megXT" U44V2M.JED, and it worked fine. But, I suppose that's a more simple fuse map. I have a hand full of the Lattice GAL16V8B chips. If you like, Chuck, I could mail you a couple to play with, free of charge of course. Just send me a PM if interested.
 
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Chuck(G) said:
Well, funny you should ask--I just struggled a bit with my programmer today (turned out to be a bad cable--doh!).

I burned a NS GAL16V8 and tried it and it works fine. I note that you're using a Lattice GAL16V8D, using my JEDEC file for the 16V8. That might be the fly in the ointment--I did verify that your fuse map matched mine. However, that doesn't tell us if Lattice goofed around with the fuse meanings. I'll probably have some sort of answer this week.

Programmable logic can be like networking or SCSI--Voodoo. :)
Click to expand...

Hiya Chuck(G) !!!
so with another GAL you got the SB part getting recognized too? Does creative's disgnose utility reports the card fine? Do you hear FM music + sfx in Wolfenstein3D for example?
Don't get me wrong for asking, it's a bit "tricky" to verify operation because some software either detects and uses FM or SFX or edtect the card but can't use it or just fail alltogether ... :)
At any rate I am confident you will solve this extra mystery :)
 
Hey Chuck,
Did you see my previuos post. I'm thinkin' you might have missed it because you posted just a few minuets later

Greg
 
Well, if you'd like, sure--my programmer will take them just fine.

I used the NSC toolset (EQN2JED) because I have a potload of NSC GALs, but I'll have to look and see if I've still got some Lattice stuff as well. I may have some 16V8s in PLCC.
 
Update

Update

I recieved my new GAL's yesterday THESE ONES. Thought a National Semiconductor part might work better than the Lattice GAL that I'd tried before but had some trouble. First, My programmer ,TOP853, Doesn't have a selection that exactly matches this GAL. The closest match is NS GAL16V8 with no dash number or letter. The chips I bought are NS GAL16V8-25LNC. Three of the four chips that I bought don't blank completely no matter how many times I try. The one that did blank completely also "appears to program correctly" and compares correctly with the JED file. This chip still doesn't work in My REV 0 board but it does two things the Lattice chip doesn't. As soon as the machine is powered on, a strange noise is produced through the speakers connected to the Sound Blaster. It's kind of a high pitched squeal almost like the sound a Dial up modem makes durring the "handshake". But not quite. Then when I run SBTEST.EXE, The board fails the FM and The voice tests. With the Lattice chip, it passes these two tests but the CMS option doesn't show up. The NS chip also doesn't produce the CMS option test either.


Chuck, have you made any progress with the Lattice chips?

I'm finding the Lattice chips are much easier to find on EBAY than NS ones.
 
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I just recoded the equations in CUPL and the two JED fuse map files don't even resemble one another. So next step is burn some GALs and give it a try.

Anyone care to post a couple of nice detailed photos of the Rev 1 board that I did the original work with? Since I don't have it to compare with, I'm guessing that they're very close, but let's see...
 
Chuck(G) said:
I just recoded the equations in CUPL and the two JED fuse map files don't even resemble one another. So next step is burn some GALs and give it a try.

Anyone care to post a couple of nice detailed photos of the Rev 1 board that I did the original work with? Since I don't have it to compare with, I'm guessing that they're very close, but let's see...
Click to expand...

This is getting really interesting. Chuck, When do you think you'll be ready to post another JED file for others of us to try out? Do you think the new one will work with a Lattice GAL and Rev 0 board?
 
Dunno--if I have time tonight, I'll give it a go and report back. Since CUPL is a Lattice tool, I'd expect it to work with Lattice ICs.

More later.
 
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