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What's a RAM Disk?

A

ardsleytank

Experienced Member
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Okay, so a local computer shop has an Apple IIGS that was brought in by a customer.

I asked the guys at the shop about it, and they said there's a chance the owner might sell it. Problem is, it needs a RAM Disk, and they can't find one.

Now, I have done very little research, but there seems to be little to no information about RAM disks.

And it's unlikely that I'll buy it, considering I don't have the space for it. But I figure I could help them out by asking here.

So, does anyone know where one can find one of these elusive RAM disks?

Thanks,
Peter
 
I thought it was part of the IIgs Control Panel setup. Just like any other RAM disk, a portion of memory can be removed from normal use and made to pretend to be a disk drive.
 
ardsleytank said:
Problem is, it needs a RAM Disk, and they can't find one.
Click to expand...
It definitely does not need a "RAM disk." It might need more RAM (i.e. IIgs machines, especially ROM01 machines, often came with an additional RAM card to boost memory enough to load GSOS), or it might need a boot disk so it can run a disk-based operating system. But it doesn't need a RAM disk in any form or fashion in order to run. Not to put too fine a point on it, but either they misspoke or you misheard. ;-)
 
There were some cards, such as the Applied Engineering GS RAM Ultra whose main function was as a RAM disk or cache and even had "keeper" battery power supplies.

But that's probably not what the guys in the store had in mind...
 
David_schmit,

Thanks what I was guessing, they need a boot disk. Truth be told, I don't think they know what's wrong with it.
Now that I know what a RAM disk is, it reall doesn't make sense why it won't boot. It get's to a blue screen, that's all I know. Is it possible somebody pulled the HDD, and it wants the RAM disk to make up for it?
 
To Amiga users, a RAM disk is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

To IIgs users, it may come in handy.

To everyone else, it's an underutilised curiosity.

:)
 
ardsleytank said:
David_schmit,

Thanks what I was guessing, they need a boot disk. Truth be told, I don't think they know what's wrong with it.
Now that I know what a RAM disk is, it reall doesn't make sense why it won't boot. It get's to a blue screen, that's all I know. Is it possible somebody pulled the HDD, and it wants the RAM disk to make up for it?
Click to expand...

The IIgs will boot to a blue screen with white lettering, that is the default text colors. It's looking for a bootable disk, in either an attached floppy drive, or a hard drive if one is equipped.

Eventually, it should time out to "Check startup device" screen with an Apple bouncing left and right.
 
I have little experience with vintage Apple computers, so I have little to add to identifying what's wrong with the IIgs.

RAM disks, on the other hand, is quite a nice feature for floppy-only systems that got the nessecary RAM. It simply works like a floppy-drive, but is often as fast or even faster than a HDD would have been. You typically temporarely use it as a working directory, for files and programs you access a lot during one session.
 
Okay, so does that mean it doesn't have a Hard Drive?

If it does have one, where can I get a boot floppy? Sorry for the lack of info...
 
Okay, so I got off the phone with the guy at the shop. It's asking for a HDD or boot floppy as suggested above.

I asked him if it had a hard-drive installed, turns out there isn't. So, the million-dollar question is... What type of HDD's did these things use? SCSI, IDE, MFM?
 
ardsleytank said:
Okay, so does that mean it doesn't have a Hard Drive?

If it does have one, where can I get a boot floppy? Sorry for the lack of info...
Click to expand...

It was relatively rare for IIgs to have a hard drive and the hard drives tended to be external. Floppy drives were external as well. If it isn't being bundled with them, it might take effort finding matching drives. I am sure someone could create a correct 5.25" or 3.5" IIgs disk once drives are located.

Edit: Would need to see what cards were added. SCSI was the most common hard drive interface with a IIgs but other cards for other interfaces did exist.

If you could find out what error message the IIgs is offering, that might help determine what is happening. I can think of a few rare cards that would give strange startup warnings if incorrectly configured like from a 30 year battery having failed. Cards that are rare enough that it might well be worth taking a non-functional IIgs in the hopes of getting the cards back to a working state.
 
Last edited:
Hmm, so they could boot from just one floppy? I thought the OS had to be installed, or is that what the whole RAM disk is about?

I'm confused. :(
 
ardsleytank said:
Hmm, so they could boot from just one floppy? I thought the OS had to be installed, or is that what the whole RAM disk is about?

I'm confused. :(
Click to expand...

It can boot from a single floppy. The RAM disk's main use was to store a copy of the application + OS disk freeing the floppy drive for a data disk. Apple II software generally could only use 64k of RAM; IIgs frequently had 1 MB. All that extra RAM would go to waste unless used as a RAM disk. A lot of Apple II software used overlays to swap parts of the program into memory; swapping from a RAM disk is a lot faster. Of course, the RAM disk would often need to be shrunk or turned off if one runs Apple IIgs specific software. It may have a relatively svelte GUI but it still needs a lot more than 64k to run a graphical word processor.

Please note: some RAM disk designs could be backed with batteries giving the equivalent of a hard disk with files stored all the time. Those batteries needed replacing about once a year.
 
So, could a floppy-only GS run GS/OS? Or would it have to run something like ProDOS or DOS 3.3 like the previous models?
 
ardsleytank said:
Hmm, so they could boot from just one floppy? I thought the OS had to be installed, or is that what the whole RAM disk is about?

I'm confused. :(
Click to expand...
No it absolutely does not need a HD. You do need one or more floppy drives. I would purchase a 5.25 and a 3.5 so that you can run not only IIgs software on 3.5 but also Apple II software on 5.25 disks. GSOS can be installed on a HD but it can also be run somewhat from a floppy. There are also expansion card you can buy that will allow you to use a Compact Flash card as a hard drive. But to skip confusion just purchase at least a 3.5" drive. If you have access to an older Mac, like a Power Mac G3 beige or earlier, you can actually download 3.5" disk images and write them to a floppy to be able to boot up the IIgs.

Once you get a drive, plug it in to the back and place a bootable disk in the drive and turn on the power. Here is a list of the types of Apple disk drives available and which ones will work with IIgs:
http://vintagemacworld.com/drives.html
 
Well, the great thing is, it comes with I think three drives. It has two of the same type, can't remember. Either two 5 1/4" and one 3.5" or two 3.5" and one 5 1/4"...
 
ardsleytank said:
Okay, so I got off the phone with the guy at the shop. It's asking for a HDD or boot floppy as suggested above.

I asked him if it had a hard-drive installed, turns out there isn't. So, the million-dollar question is... What type of HDD's did these things use? SCSI, IDE, MFM?
Click to expand...

A hard drive isn't necessary for the system, most were floppy based. SCSI and IDE were common, but you need a controller in addition to the hard drive.

There are modern cards (CFFA 3000, TurboIDE, etc.) that are much better than an older unreliable drive. The CFFA 3000 uses usb thumb drives, and will emulate floppies in addition to hard drives.

Since the IIgs system includes floppy drives, that's all you need to get started. Just buy a serial cable to connect the IIgs to a modern PC, and you can use ADTpro to create floppies from downloadable disk images.
 
ardsleytank said:
Well, the great thing is, it comes with I think three drives. It has two of the same type, can't remember. Either two 5 1/4" and one 3.5" or two 3.5" and one 5 1/4"...
Click to expand...

Time to take it. The system seems to work. The Apple external drives were reliable and with 3 to choose from, one should still work. Some cleaning might be needed. Get some disks and have fun.
 
Okay, so I need a quick quote. If it was in good condition, with little to no yellowing, had two 3.5" drives and one 5 1/4" drive, with working keyboard and mouse, what's a good price to pay?

I need to know what to expect. :D
 
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