Help me with my serial mouse

[mattisengstedt]

Hi!
So I got a Compaq Portable 386 and have now tried two different serial mice with no luck, one of them was unused.

A 3-button "Quick mouse"
A 3-button Logitech mouse

After fiddling with Microsoft Mouse driver and googling I found out it only works for 2-button mice?

Can anyone help me with drivers? I downloaded Logitech Mouseware but couldn't install it. I'm not very dos-savvy.

 

[krebizfan]

The MS mouse drive will work with most Logitech serial mice but only two of the mouse buttons will be used. Since very little DOS software uses the third mouse button, not being able to use the middle button won't have an adverse result.

Have you tried CuteMouse which is a modern reworking of the DOS mouse drivers?

Which version of Mouseware did you download? For DOS, you will need an older version. The MW I remember had to unzipped and then the resulting files provide an executable that can be run to automate the install. How far along the process did you get?

Which Logitech mouse model? Who made the Quick Mouse (if it says)? Some models do behave differently and having that information can save a lengthy pursuit of false leads.

 

[Svenska]

Try CuteMouse (CTMOUSE). It tends to work really well and uses a lot less memory compared to the Microsoft drivers. It supports both mice using the Microsoft and the Mouse Systems protocols.

 

[mattisengstedt]

The MS mouse drive will work with most Logitech serial mice but only two of the mouse buttons will be used. Since very little DOS software uses the third mouse button, not being able to use the middle button won't have an adverse result.

Have you tried CuteMouse which is a modern reworking of the DOS mouse drivers?

Which version of Mouseware did you download? For DOS, you will need an older version. The MW I remember had to unzipped and then the resulting files provide an executable that can be run to automate the install. How far along the process did you get?

Which Logitech mouse model? Who made the Quick Mouse (if it says)? Some models do behave differently and having that information can save a lengthy pursuit of false leads.

I'll update with the Quick Mouse model tomorrow but the Logitech is M-MD15L.

I've installed Mouseware 7, Microsoft Mouse, Cute Mouse 1.9 and Compaq Mouse drivers but no luck. Mouseware had a program to check the com port and it detected "something" from it. But when booting it threw error messages about not finding the mouse.

Could it be a jumper or bios issue?

I have a 2000 ish Pentium 4 pc with a serial port, was thinking of trying the mice on that one. Does Windows 98 include drivers?

Try CuteMouse (CTMOUSE). It tends to work really well and uses a lot less memory compared to the Microsoft drivers. It supports both mice using the Microsoft and the Mouse Systems protocols.

Tried 1.9 but didnt work, gonna try a different version and see.

 

[modem7]

So I got a Compaq Portable 386 and have now tried two different serial mice with no luck, one of them was unused.

There exists the possibility that the serial port is faulty.

CheckIt software and SERTEST are two examples of DOS programs that can check out an RS-232 serial port. In all cases, to fully test the serial port, you will need to connect a loopback plug to the port's connector, and get the software to do an external loopback test.

 

[mattisengstedt]

There exists the possibility that the serial port is faulty.

CheckIt software and SERTEST are two examples of DOS programs that can check out an RS-232 serial port. In all cases, to fully test the serial port, you will need to connect a loopback plug to the port's connector, and get the software to do an external loopback test.

I'll see if I can wire up a loopback plug and test the port, thanks!

 

[SomeGuy]

Most generic three button serial mice (other than Logitec) are also Microsoft serial compatible. These usually have an alternate "Mouse Systems" compatible mode, either a switch or holding down a mouse button at startup, that switches to the Mouse Systems protocol and can use the middle mouse button.

Also, when running CheckIT, note the address and IRQ of the serial port. On the off chance those are not configured to standards, some mouse drivers may have issues with it.

 

[mattisengstedt]

The Quick Mouse is a generic Taiwanese, model QM-0E1

 

[mattisengstedt]

There exists the possibility that the serial port is faulty.

CheckIt software and SERTEST are two examples of DOS programs that can check out an RS-232 serial port. In all cases, to fully test the serial port, you will need to connect a loopback plug to the port's connector, and get the software to do an external loopback test.

So I wired up a loopback test and it passed all the tests.

Most generic three button serial mice (other than Logitec) are also Microsoft serial compatible. These usually have an alternate "Mouse Systems" compatible mode, either a switch or holding down a mouse button at startup, that switches to the Mouse Systems protocol and can use the middle mouse button.

Also, when running CheckIT, note the address and IRQ of the serial port. On the off chance those are not configured to standards, some mouse drivers may have issues with it.

Passed all the tests. The screen is a bit hard to read, gas plasma with lines, but I think it says 03F8 and IRQ3

 

[Svenska]

Well... COM1 should be at 0x3F8 / IRQ4 and COM2 should be at 0x2F8 / IRQ3. If they are not, you have a non-standard configuration and might need to tell your mouse driver.

Are you sure at least one of your mice work?

 

[mattisengstedt]

Well... COM1 should be at 0x3F8 / IRQ4 and COM2 should be at 0x2F8 / IRQ3. If they are not, you have a non-standard configuration and might need to tell your mouse driver.

Are you sure at least one of your mice work

Hm wonder if I missread. Attached a photo of the docs, everything is default now.

Edit: gonna double check the jumpers too.

And no I haven't tested them myself, don't have a functional second pc with a serial port :/

 

[mattisengstedt]

Nope, it says "IRQ3 responded" in SERTEST interrupt test.

 

[Svenska]

Try to run "CTMOUSE /S13", which should force it to use COM1 with IRQ3.

 

[mattisengstedt]

Try to run "CTMOUSE /S13", which should force it to use COM1 with IRQ3.

THAT SOLVED IT!!!

Thank you so much, this saved me so much headache and I would never have solved it on my own.

The question is though, why is it IRQ4? Docs claim it should be IRQ3 as default. Would be nice to solve the core issue instead of workarounds.

 

[SomeGuy]

I'd double check the jumpers, make sure they are all making good contact, and in the right positions. Frequently on I/O devices one of the jumper sets is just for IRQ and may be set independently of the I/O address. A previous owner may have changed jumpers for a variety of reasons.

Also, you may be able to manually specify port and IRQ as a commandline parameter on your mouse driver, but then you could still run in to problems with any programs/environments that insist on controlling the mouse directly.

 

[Svenska]

The question is though, why is it IRQ4?

Because IBM said so, back in the early 80s. They defined four standard serial ports:

• COM1 at 0x3F8 and IRQ 4
• COM2 at 0x2F8 and IRQ 3
• COM3 at 0x3E8 and IRQ 4
• COM4 at 0x2E8 and IRQ 3

Note that COM1/COM3 and COM2/COM4 share their IRQs, which means in practice only one of each pair can be used at a time (or at least one of the ports is operated in polled mode, which does not use the IRQ). That is why some cards allow setting non-standard IRQs, which was especially important for terminal servers.

At least now we have identified the problem and proven that nothing is broken. The proper fix for you is to set the card's jumpers to a default configuration. (You can also set it to COM2, but some applications will be very confused if COM1 is missing.)

 

[mattisengstedt]

I'd double check the jumpers, make sure they are all making good contact, and in the right positions. Frequently on I/O devices one of the jumper sets is just for IRQ and may be set independently of the I/O address. A previous owner may have changed jumpers for a variety of reasons.

Also, you may be able to manually specify port and IRQ as a commandline parameter on your mouse driver, but then you could still run in to problems with any programs/environments that insist on controlling the mouse directly.

Because IBM said so, back in the early 80s. They defined four standard serial ports:

• COM1 at 0x3F8 and IRQ 4
• COM2 at 0x2F8 and IRQ 3
• COM3 at 0x3E8 and IRQ 4
• COM4 at 0x2E8 and IRQ 3

Note that COM1/COM3 and COM2/COM4 share their IRQs, which means in practice only one of each pair can be used at a time (or at least one of the ports is operated in polled mode, which does not use the IRQ). That is why some cards allow setting non-standard IRQs, which was especially important for terminal servers.

At least now we have identified the problem and proven that nothing is broken. The proper fix for you is to set the card's jumpers to a default configuration. (You can also set it to COM2, but some applications will be very confused if COM1 is missing.)

I´ll double check em, the visible jumpers are default but there are two that´s hidden under a plate. I haven´t checked em with a multimeter though.

In the next couple of days I´m going to pick it apart to see if I can make the screen a little better so I´ll check then.

 

[Svenska]

In the next couple of days I´m going to pick it apart to see if I can make the screen a little better so I´ll check then.

If you have a nullmodem cable, you can run "MODE COM1:9600,N,8,1" followed by "CTTY COM1" to get a DOS remote console. It only works for simple text applications, but it may be helpful. I also use such a cable extensively for file transfer.

Obviously, it uses COM1, but if you can add another serial port, you could use it to help debug.