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Is Turbo C available?

GreyHairedDECfan

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I've come across places where you can download Turbo C, and it's supposedly free to use. Is that legit? I don't know who owns the rights to the old Borland stuff.
 

carlos12

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Yes! But with some restrictions: IIRC, the compilers cannot be used for releasing commercial products. Also some essential tools such as Turbo Assembler are missing from the release (inline assemby will not work without it, and it will not be possible to compile projects with external modules if they are written in assembly). Also no Turbo Debugger or Turbo Profiler.

I really thank the Embarcadero's move, but more than 30 years after the original releases, I think they could have given away all the software without any restriction, having into account that even in case someone would like to do everything legally (I would do it, of course, if I'd was to release a commercial piece of software), they don't even offer the chance to buy a license :-(
 

Plasma

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Only Turbo C/C++ "Professional" included Turbo Assembler/Debugger. If you got the regular version you had to buy TASM separately. Starting with C++ 3.0 they split into two product lines, probably to minimize confusion. Turbo C++ for home users and Borland C++ for pro users.

I agree it would be nice if all old software was released without restriction, but at least Embarcadero is doing something. Microsoft never made QuickC or QuickBASIC available to download.

I don't see anything that says the license has changed, only that there is no support. You could buy a used copy on ebay if you are concerned I guess.
 

carlos12

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You could buy a used copy on ebay if you are concerned I guess.
Not too easy, at least not in my country :(

Anyway, we are talking about an almost dead platform (DOS), and about some tools that are more than 30 years old. I highly doubt anybody is going to trace whatever the new code produced for DOS is done with this or that tool. No concern at all on my side, it's only I would like to have the chance to buy an official license if available, and if it was at a reasonable price. Nevertheless, no major problem if it's not that way ;)
 

Plasma

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https://edn.embarcadero.com/article/20841


Officially, the download cannot be used for anything else than personal use.
I interpreted that statement to mean personal use of Turbo C itself (i.e. you couldn't resell Turbo C), not any programs you created with it. But I could be incorrect.

Another option to obtain a legal Borland C++ license is to purchase the boxed book "Sams' Teach Yourself C++ in 21 Days: Complete Compiler Edition" (ISBN 9780672312618, 1998 edition). It includes a complete version of Borland C++ 3.1, including Turbo Assembler and Debugger.
 
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twolazy

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I have a copy of borland C++, let me make sure all the diskettes work. If they do you can have them for price of shipping. I hardly code anymore. Also have Quattro pro 1.0 and Paradox for windows 1.0 if they are useful. If you want all them, throw me a box of diskettes. =)
 

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cappy2112

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I've come across places where you can download Turbo C, and it's supposedly free to use. Is that legit? I don't know who owns the rights to the old Borland stuff.
Embarcdero's site shows TurboC 2.0 only, I might have TurboC 3.0 somewhere.
If I'm not mistaken, Turbo C 3.1 was the last version before Borland C/C++ came out. I remember having a set of 11(?) VHS tapes teaching C++ , these came with Borland C/C++ 3.x I believe.
 

twolazy

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Well i imaged the C++, one disk has a bad sector though. Whats with all the 3.5's i've been loosing lately. All my 5.25s have been rock solid... Weird.

Anywho I have a copy in Winimage format, one the help files is what took the hit, so shouldnt be a huge deal. Shame though. Its 720kb diskettes, havent seen a copy of it online.
 

cappy2112

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Well i imaged the C++, one disk has a bad sector though. Whats with all the 3.5's i've been loosing lately. All my 5.25s have been rock solid... Weird.

Anywho I have a copy in Winimage format, one the help files is what took the hit, so shouldnt be a huge deal. Shame though. Its 720kb diskettes, havent seen a copy of it online.
It's a well-known fact that old floppies delaminate and are unreliable in modern times. Some are worse than others.
This is why systems such as Kryoflux have been developed.
 

kerravon

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I've come across places where you can download Turbo C, and it's supposedly free to use. Is that legit? I don't know who owns the rights to the old Borland stuff.
Would you mind telling me what you want Turbo C for? I find it disturbing that a lot of stuff, including MSDOS itself, is withdrawn from sale when people still want to buy it.
 

Unknown_K

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Very few people want to buy MSDOS and there are plenty of original on sale on ebay for them.

Personally if the company who made the software no longer exists, and used copies are no longer around for sale then just pirate it. You should be able to find printed manuals or manuals in PDF online for it (the only reason most people want boxed editions anyway).

I have a boxed copy of Borland Turbo C++3.0 for DOS on my shelf over my head. Purchased from ebay a decade ago for something to do with my old machines. It does seem that the quantity of DOS era programming software on ebay is not what it used to be, and prices have gone up a bit.
 

kerravon

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I have a boxed copy of Borland Turbo C++3.0 for DOS on my shelf over my head. Purchased from ebay a decade ago for something to do with my old machines.
Can you tell me what you are doing on your old machines?

BTW, is it possible to buy working IBM PC XT clones with a 20 MB hard disk? I'd like to ensure PDOS/86 is not using any non-8088 instructions.

Also did any XT clones have a BIOS with LBA support, as my hard disk support is currently dependent on LBA to support big disks?
 

carlos12

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I find it disturbing that a lot of stuff, including MSDOS itself, is withdrawn from sale when people still want to buy it.
Microsoft released the source code of MS-DOS 1.25 and 2.0 a few years ago. They put the superbly permisive MIT license. So, from 2018 it's totally legal to use DOS 1.25 or 2.0 whatever the place and origin of the software. Anyway, I don't think they have any problem with people who uses later versions pirated. Windows XP and later is another history, as it's a current system (although now without official support, it can run many modern applications). In fact, WinWorldPC.com has a huge repository of CPM and DOS applications (along with the actual operating systems...), and they don't seem to have any legal problems at all. And Microsoft doesn't hesitate to sue anybody, sometimes even with some quite stupid reasons, like when they sued Mike Row for funding Mike Row Soft, or when they sued Lindows...

Would you mind telling me what you want Turbo C for?
Can you tell me what you are doing on your old machines?
You asked to other users but I hope you don't mind I tell my personal reasons

I like to develop for old machines, and also want to have the opportunity to compile and assemble on the same target machines. I'm also very much used to ANSI 90 C and the Turbo C extensions for DOS, as they are the ones I used on it's time 25-30 years ago. I tried to develop some apps on Open Watcom and I found some little differences quite disturbing (such as adding an underscore after the name of the external assembly procedures, instead of the more standard prefixed). I also got sick of the bugs that drove me crazy as I didn't know if the failure was in my code on in Watcom's. It's not that Borland is free of bugs (of course not...) but let's say I'm more accustomed to them.

BTW, is it possible to buy working IBM PC XT clones with a 20 MB hard disk?

Yes! In fact, I bought one a few months ago. It's something close to a DTK Turbo XT. It costed me 100 eur plus delivery expenses. I didn't buy it thought Ebay, though but on something similar to Craigslist in my country. Ebay is usually too expensive.


Also did any XT clones have a BIOS with LBA support, as my hard disk support is currently dependent on LBA to support big disks?

I don't know, but I can say that I installed an XT-CF expansion card with a 2 gig CF card and the system works perfectly. But I know that the XT-CF expansion has its own BIOS anyway...
 
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carlos12

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Sorry for the double post. It just posted without pressing any button (at least not something I'm aware of... Maybe I confused "Post reply" with "Preview")

I'd like to ensure PDOS/86 is not using any non-8088 instructions.

Just set your C compiler options to assure the generated code is not going to issue post-8086 instructions. If using assembler modules, you can also add a directive that simply warns you if you put a 186+ instruction (for instance, .8086 in MASM/TASM). If doing assembly, just avoid to use instructions such as PUSHA, POPA, SHL REG,num-greater-than-1, etc.)

You can also try your code on DosBox-X (it allows to set many different processors, including the 8086, which is 100% machine code compatible with the 8088), or an ancient virtual machine emulator such as PC-Em or its fork, 86Box.
 

Unknown_K

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Some of my old machines are for gaming, but I like playing with OS/2, WFW, Desqview/X etc. I have a small but nice collection of boxed apps for programming and office type work for those older OS as well. Visual Basic 3 is fun to play with.
 
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