It's getting there, slowly but surely...

[TomFCS]

Well it's been just slightly over one year since I started my storage room project and thought I would post an update of the progress so far.

Most all of the rough construction is completed, with the exception of building an audio equipment rack and installing some additional small shelves for manuals and software.

There are 13 machines presently displayed in the room, but my actual progress with them so far has been somewhat slow. This is mostly because my main goal is to complete all of the physical construction of the room first, but I'm having a hard time deciding what direction to go next.

The cheapest and easiest course of action would be to construct a nice audio rack, install it under the main counter and hopefully have enough space left, to include perhaps two more computers in the room. Quick, easy, done.

The other, not so cheap and easy option, would be to construct a whole new addition to the room, just for audio and communications gear. Locating the audio rack in the new room, would allow me to fit perhaps five, instead of only two more computers into the main room.

I have to admit, the thought of having a second room, with a dedicated listening area, is certainly appealing. The biggest hurdle to this is, of course, time and money.

Yes, I do realize that this is ultimately my own decision to make and since I'm sure I've babbled way too long about this already, I'll just stop now and post the links.

The project from the beginning, with some short captions to explain things along the way.

Same thing, but starting with the moving of the computers into the room, skipping most of the construction stuff.

Have a great day everyone.

Tom

 

[Unknown_K]

Very nice. How much did that remodeling cost? What are you using for a computer chair? How bad is heating and cooling in such a confined area?

 

[Raven]

That's what I hope to have someday, but with a different set of machines (same 5150,5160,5162,5170,PCjr Lineup tho). I'm well on my way having already attained a 5170 and 5160, but I don't have monitors..

Anyway, mind sharing the IBM type # and connector name for what appears to be a dual 8" external FDD by IBM next to that displaywriter? :D

Edit: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...f6eb97c&itemid=150471751650&ff4=263602_263622

Damn that's expensive!

Nevermind about the model number (6360, for those of you viewing this in the future when that eBay link is dead), and it does appear to be a dual 8" FDD. What's the connection, though? Looks like it's either SCSI, Parallel, or IBM-standard external FDD. If it's the last of those options, I might want to hunt one of those down sometime. For those who don't feel like clicking the eBay link, or again, for future searchers, it looks like an incomplete (missing pins) DB25 to DB.. erm.. too many for me to feel like counting. The larger DB looks like one I've seen on device-side SCSI.

Edit 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-5rKcwHZ4E

xD

 

[TomFCS]

Very nice. How much did that remodeling cost? What are you using for a computer chair? How bad is heating and cooling in such a confined area?

To be quite honest I have a pile of receipts stacked up and I haven't had the courage to add them all up yet. I'm sure it's way more than I probably want to know.

I haven't purchased a chair yet, but your right, the room is somewhat confined and quite narrow. Whatever I do eventually get, is going to have to strike a balance between size and comfort. A big plush chair just isn't going to fit.

Since I'm basically just stealing a little (probably already wasted) heat off the existing hot water lines, the heating costs have been minimal. The basement alone, even in the coldest weather, will maintain about 58 deg. With the fan arrangement, I can drive it up to about 64 deg. That's plenty warm enough for me, but it does take a fairly long time to raise the temperature to that level.

There is no actual cooling yet, just a dehumidifier and it does run quite a bit. My basement has always been fairly humid, and this year in particular has been worst than most. I would say that on average it maintains about 80 deg. at 60% relative humidity. This can vary a bit depending upon weather conditions of course. I'd like to eventually get something better worked out, but this is all I've got going for now.

 

[TomFCS]

That's what I hope to have someday, but with a different set of machines (same 5150,5160,5162,5170,PCjr Lineup tho). I'm well on my way having already attained a 5170 and 5160, but I don't have monitors..

Anyway, mind sharing the IBM type # and connector name for what appears to be a dual 8" external FDD by IBM next to that displaywriter? :D

Edit: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150471751650&rvr_id=128402331323&crlp=1_263602_263622&UA=%3F*F%3F&GUID=5efea5ba12a0a02652e3e233ff6eb97c&itemid=150471751650&ff4=263602_263622

Damn that's expensive!

Nevermind about the model number (6360, for those of you viewing this in the future when that eBay link is dead), and it does appear to be a dual 8" FDD. What's the connection, though? Looks like it's either SCSI, Parallel, or IBM-standard external FDD. If it's the last of those options, I might want to hunt one of those down sometime. For those who don't feel like clicking the eBay link, or again, for future searchers, it looks like an incomplete (missing pins) DB25 to DB.. erm.. too many for me to feel like counting. The larger DB looks like one I've seen on device-side SCSI.

Edit 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-5rKcwHZ4E

xD

Quite honestly, I don't have a clue. I've never had much luck when googling for specs regarding this machine either. Hopefully someone here can help out.

EDIT - I went and looked at that auction, that guys out of his mind. There was a complete unit on Ebay a while back for I believe a starting bid of $100.00. That included everything with software too. I looked at it for a possible parts machine but the shipping killed the deal. I don't believe anyone ever bid on it either.

 

[Unknown_K]

Sounds hot in the summer, is that the basement or ground level?

 

[sombunall]

That's a good gallery. I actually got lost in the pictures.

 

[barythrin]

Thanks for letting us see the progress. Beautiful setup! I wish I could get things looking half that nice. Separate question, but what's that keyboard you have connected to the 5150 next to the printer (left of the PCjr)? I'm not sure I've seen one like that before unless it looks larger than it is.

 

[TomFCS]

Sounds hot in the summer, is that the basement or ground level?

It's mostly underground. That's part of the problem. One possible cooling solution I can come up with, would be to take a roto-hammer, knock out a big chunk of brick at the top of the room and install a small A/C window unit into the opening. Even then, it would be close to sitting on the ground outside. Dirty, messy and unfortunately not a very easy option to do at this point.

 

[TomFCS]

Thanks for letting us see the progress. Beautiful setup! I wish I could get things looking half that nice. Separate question, but what's that keyboard you have connected to the 5150 next to the printer (left of the PCjr)? I'm not sure I've seen one like that before unless it looks larger than it is.

Thanks barythrin, if it's the Displaywriter keyboard your seeing, the manufacture tag on it is as follows:

ID. NO. 630X-91-XXX58140
MODEL 00 1
PART NO. 2682678
DATE OF MFG. 81-W41

 

[Raven]

It's mostly underground. That's part of the problem. One possible cooling solution I can come up with, would be to take a roto-hammer, knock out a big chunk of brick at the top of the room and install a small A/C window unit into the opening. Even then, it would be close to sitting on the ground outside. Dirty, messy and unfortunately not a very easy option to do at this point.

I did some research into designing my own home with eccentric heating/cooling/water systems, and have an idea that might work for you..

- Drill a 10' slot in the ground (depth depends on ground temperature where you are and how cold you want it, really - might need to be deeper).
- Place a U-shaped pipe or vent system in the slot.
- Fill the extra space with dirt/cement/etc.
- Run one of the ends of the U up toward the ceiling as a vent or pipe.
- Mount variable-speed fans on each end of the pipe, the raised one blowing down and the other blowing up.
- You now have a fairly cheap cooling system using the natural earth temperature. :D

As I said, it's an eccentric solution I conceived myself, so I understand if you think I'm crazy, lol.

 

[glitch]

Geothermal heat exchangers can be a pretty good solution, especially when you're already down at basement depth. Unfortunately, unless your basement is like ours (dirt floor) you'll be digging through a lot of concrete. The problem with blowing air through the in-ground exchanger is that air isn't that great of a heat transfer medium. Most commercial systems use water, or an antifreeze mix if the system is used for heating.

We managed to solve the window issue of air conditioning when I lived on-campus in college. You weren't allowed to have window air conditioners since they could fall out and kill someone. We built a plywood box to insert the air conditioner in, and added two 4" flex vent hoses to the back, with a blower pulling air through one of the vents. This allowed us to run outside air around the exchanger that usually hangs out the window while only having two hoses in the window rather than the AC unit. If you've got the room under a table or something, you might do that to avoid cutting through the brick (having just cut a 1x1' hole through our foundation to bring in the water line, with a cold chisel and hammer, I know how much fun that is!)

 

[Unknown_K]

Air would not work at all, you would need moving water and a decent length of underground pipe with a heat exchanger/fan combination in the house.

 

[Raven]

Well yeah I didn't do any calculations to determine how effective it would be, I admit - wasn't sure if air would be effective enough or not.

 

[mark66j]

It's mostly underground. That's part of the problem. One possible cooling solution I can come up with, would be to take a roto-hammer, knock out a big chunk of brick at the top of the room and install a small A/C window unit into the opening. Even then, it would be close to sitting on the ground outside. Dirty, messy and unfortunately not a very easy option to do at this point.

A better (but quite a bit more expensive) solution would be a split system A/C unit -- this only requires holes big enough to run pipes thorugh to the outside, and the pipes can run a fair distance to where you want to put the compressor outside. The inside units of these are fairly quiet. The systems generally run a lot more than a window unit, and also require professional installation (we have one that unforunately is still not working because our "professionals" did not know what they were doing, apparently). They do usually require 240 volt service.

Given some vents between rooms a unit like that could keep your entire basement cool and dry.

There are also portable units like the Penguino that might work for you.

 

[TomFCS]

A better (but quite a bit more expensive) solution would be a split system A/C unit -- this only requires holes big enough to run pipes thorugh to the outside

That's a good idea. At a previous place of employment there was a split unit in the break room. I completely forgot all about those types until you mentioned them now. With the layout of the new room and the location of the adjacent unfinished space, it would probably be fairly easy to do.

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If I mounted the unit on the south wall of the new room and ran the piping through the unfinished part of the basement, I would be looking at only about a 12' to maybe 15' run to reach an outside wall. It would be a fairly straight shot too.

​

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The piping could also be angled slightly upward and tucked away inside upstairs floor joist for a nice clean installation.

​

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Think I'll google a bit and see what a ballpark cost would be.



​

 

[tezza]

Hi Tom,

Yes, I need a dedicated room for my own systems also *sigh*. For me, it will have to wait for retirement I think and/or a large injection of cash. In the meantime I'll just have to keep dragging them out of boxes when I want to exercise them and leave any public display to the web.

Good luck with finishing the project.

Tez

 

[TomFCS]

Wow, I priced some split units and even though they would most likely be an excellent solution, they are WAY too expensive to even consider. Regardless, there are some really good ideas here and you folks certainly have me thinking about this now.

So, what about using ground water? A long time ago I was kicking around the idea of sinking a well point and using it to get free water to sprinkle the lawn with. A guy who lived down the street from me was doing this back then and he claimed it worked well.

I live very close Lake Michigan and the water table here is fairly high, so I went and found some water resource data for my area. Using that information and figuring in the depth of the basement, it looks like I could perhaps hit water in as little as 10 to 12 feet. That would certainly be doable.

My early idea is to use an old set of refrigeration coils, some fans, a pump and a couple of solenoid valves. Simply pump water up to fill the coils, circulate the water for an appropriate time or temperature interval, flip the valves to drain the system out to the city storm sewer and flip them again for the next refill. Then rinse and repeat as often as needed.

I went ahead and made a rough drawing of the idea below.

Any thoughts positive or negative are certainly welcome.

 

[Unknown_K]

Wow, I priced some split units and even though they would most likely be an excellent solution, they are WAY too expensive to even consider. Regardless, there are some really good ideas here and you folks certainly have me thinking about this now.

So, what about using ground water? A long time ago I was kicking around the idea of sinking a well point and using it to get free water to sprinkle the lawn with. A guy who lived down the street from me was doing this back then and he claimed it worked well.

I live very close Lake Michigan and the water table here is fairly high, so I went and found some water resource data for my area. Using that information and figuring in the depth of the basement, it looks like I could perhaps hit water in as little as 10 to 12 feet. That would certainly be doable.

My early idea is to use an old set of refrigeration coils, some fans, a pump and a couple of solenoid valves. Simply pump water up to fill the coils, circulate the water for an appropriate time or temperature interval, flip the valves to drain the system out to the city storm sewer and flip them again for the next refill. Then rinse and repeat as often as needed.

I went ahead and made a rough drawing of the idea below.

Any thoughts positive or negative are certainly welcome.

First off I asume the water in the well will not freeze in winter? I would think you need dual pumps, one sump pump to raise the water 12 feet into a small open air tank (that has a low level switch to start pumping and a high level switch to turn it off so it doesn't overflow), and a second pump to presurise the water to get flow through the coil. You will need to know what the water temp is going to be, it has to be 25F or so lower then desired room temp or there is no driving force for heat transfer.