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MS Typing Tutor for the IBM PC on... cassette?

VileR

VileR

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Check this out (emphasis mine):

Infoworld said:
...Also in the series is a Microsoft program, Typing Tutor, which offers touch-typing drill and practice. Typing Tutor is one education program that is even offered on cassette, a feature common to many early Apple programs but rare on the IBM.
Click to expand...
I wasn't aware that any commercial PC software was ever available on tape (though IBM had a tape version of their PC Diagnostics program, if that counts). There's at least one early game that supports saving to a cassette (Galaxy from Avalon Hill) but this is the first time I read about anything that actually sold on one... needless to say, that would be quite an interesting find.

I stumbled on this while looking for clues about IBM's Arithmetic Games Set 2, which I'm also on the lookout for... I don't s'pose there's anyone here who might be a proud owner of that? :)
 
el_VR said:
Check this out (emphasis mine):


I wasn't aware that any commercial PC software was ever available on tape (though IBM had a tape version of their PC Diagnostics program, if that counts). There's at least one early game that supports saving to a cassette (Galaxy from Avalon Hill) but this is the first time I read about anything that actually sold on one... needless to say, that would be quite an interesting find.

I stumbled on this while looking for clues about IBM's Arithmetic Games Set 2, which I'm also on the lookout for... I don't s'pose there's anyone here who might be a proud owner of that? :)
Click to expand...

That has been my general assessment as well. As far as I knew there were TWO cassette programs - both from IBM (Diagnostics and Advanced Diagnostics). There is a question if there was an introduction to the PC on cassette as well or not but an actual commercial program? Now that would be something to see. Do you have a copy of Galaxy?

Edit: Found it. I have to try it out and see how well the save to tape works....
 
If your curious, the IBM BIOS has built in routines for reading and recording data from cassette.
I haven't played with it, just remember noticing them.
 
IIRC, there was a version of BASIC that fully supported the cassette interface.
 
SpidersWeb said:
Yep, it's built in to ROM and is loaded when the IBM can't boot off disk. It's a bit of a laugh when you see a PS/2 do that.
Click to expand...

I don't remember any of my PS/2's doing that. Either something was different, or I just don't remember.

My 5150 PC definitely did, but when it would boot to BASIC, I would just put a different (boot) disk in.:rolleyes:
 
KC9UDX said:
I don't remember any of my PS/2's doing that. Either something was different, or I just don't remember.

My 5150 PC definitely did, but when it would boot to BASIC, I would just put a different (boot) disk in.:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

All IBM Systems through the PS/2 line had ROM BASIC. ROM BASIC does allow for tape access. If you are really interested there is a very good post by Mike B. on how to use the tape interface! I am more interested though in commercial applications making use of the tape on the IBM PC. As I mentioned I only knew of the two IBM cassettes but apparently there was an MS app too. Does anyone know how long the 5150 was in production before IBM started making FDDs available? My guess has always been that very few (IF ANY) IBM 5150s were sold initially without a FDD and hence there was never a need to produce programs on tape...
 
AFAIK floppy drives were an option from day one, and IBM never sold a tape recorder/player? (not confirmed, just what I thought)

KC9UDX said:
I don't remember any of my PS/2's doing that. Either something was different, or I just don't remember.

My 5150 PC definitely did, but when it would boot to BASIC, I would just put a different (boot) disk in.:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Last time I spotted it was either my Model 30-286 or Model 50Z - had the hard drive disconnected and it went straight in to BASIC.
 
I don't know about producing them before FDDs were available for them, but I have owned several 5150s that didn't come with any disk drives. I've known other people who did also, so they weren't rare. In fact, I still have pieces-parts of one that was like that.

Usually the first thing I did with them though was put drives and controller cards in.

Mind you, I don't recall ever seeing an IBM cassette drive, nor any cassette drive or anything else that would plug into the cassette port (besides Commodore peripherals that didn't belong plugged in there [Desperate college kids will try all kinds of stupid things when they are lacking all peripherals]).
 
Thinking back, it is ironic: One of the biggest derisive comments most PC users had about the Commodore 64 was that they booted to BASIC. Most of us never gave any thought to the built-in BASIC in our PCs.
 
No I think we have pretty much established that there was never and IBM branded tape drive. It is interesting to hear that a "no FDD" 5150 was a commonly seen configuration. That would imply, at launch at least, a number of programs would have had to be produced/distributed on tape. However, the first edition of the GTO came with a floppy and it was only a later revised edition that came with the tapes. So I am not sure how the time line would work out...
 
I'm finding it hard to believe that any IBM PCs were shipped without floppy drives. There is a big difference between being able to order it that way vs. actually having people do that.

I have a copy of the diagnostics on cassette. I've never seen or heard of another copy of it, and I worked at IBM for quite a few years and have been collecting PC style machines for close to 15 years. I've never seen any other software on cassette either.

Another good data point - PCjrs could be ordered without a floppy drive, but I've only ever run into one like that.

It is possible that PCs were ordered without floppy drives for use in networks, like the IBM PC Cluster network. Those cards had the option to boot remotely and use the hard drive on a more capable machine. But I think that by the time you spend 2 or 3 thousand dollars for a machine, you probably spend the extra $500 for the floppy controller and floppy drive.

Here is the link to the diagnostics on cassette and the analysis/discussion of the tape format:

http://brutman.com/Cassette_Waveforms/Cassette_Waveforms.html


Mike
 
It would take access to IBM's internal development memos to know how much cassette software was actually prepared. I seem to remember rumors suggesting that IBM was considering a complete tape equipped system for the educational market which never got released.
 
BTW, Typing Tutor was offered by IBM on cassette. The part number was 6024018; you can see an advertisement for it here:

http://tinyurl.com/jvowu4m

There was some talk about the Music Construction Set being able to generate four voice output using the cassette port; I'm looking around for some evidence of that. (I might have to fire up a machine and see what it does.)
 
mbbrutman said:
I'm finding it hard to believe that any IBM PCs were shipped without floppy drives. There is a big difference between being able to order it that way vs. actually having people do that.
Click to expand...

I always assumed these machines were ordered that way. But, the other possibility is that someone had two machines, and swapped floppy drives and blanking plates and made one dual-floppy and one no-floppy. All the ones I've seen that way were 'surplus' machines that probably originated at the University of Wisconsin, I assume. (Along with a large amount of Wang stuff!)
 
mbbrutman said:
I have a copy of the diagnostics on cassette. I've never seen or heard of another copy of it, and I worked at IBM for quite a few years and have been collecting PC style machines for close to 15 years. I've never seen any other software on cassette either.
Click to expand...

Mike,

Thanks for the part number and linkage on the MS Typing tutor. I am not sure what do you mean by "heard of another copy" but I have originals of both the Diagnostic and the Advanced Diagnostic. The color scheme matches those of the disks as well with a brown/orange tape label and blue tape label respectively.
 
KC9UDX said:
Mind you, I don't recall ever seeing an IBM cassette drive, nor any cassette drive or anything else that would plug into the cassette port (besides Commodore peripherals that didn't belong plugged in there [Desperate college kids will try all kinds of stupid things when they are lacking all peripherals]).
Click to expand...
Aside from Commodore and Atari's custom cassette drives, most systems using cassette I/O used standard portable cassette recorders with standard mic/earphone/remote jacks; all you needed was the connecting cable and IBM used the same pinout/cable as Tandy/Radio Shack's computers.
 
You and I each have a cassette with the diagnostics on it. That makes two copies that I know of.

Have you made an audio file out of the advanced diagnostics? I made my copy of the standard diagnostics available on MP3 years ago. The advanced diagnostics would be nice to see too.
 
mbbrutman said:
You and I each have a cassette with the diagnostics on it. That makes two copies that I know of.

Have you made an audio file out of the advanced diagnostics? I made my copy of the standard diagnostics available on MP3 years ago. The advanced diagnostics would be nice to see too.
Click to expand...

Well, I have seen one other copy of each as well - a full GTO/Cassette set that was sold on eBay about four years ago and a copy of the HMS with the cassette that sold about two years ago. I came by mine quite by chance. I bought a GTO off of eBay mostly to get the case to replace one of the cases on another GTO I had. The seller never mentioned what was the part number nor provide any pictures of the spine - but the price was right $4.99 + S&H. Imagine my surprise when it arrived and it was 635117 with a cassette!

Is an MP3 good enough or would someone need a WAV file to be on the safe side. I can try and make a sound file this weekend if I can find the right cables... I know I have a few 1/8" stereo cables but I am not sure if I have any 1/4" adapters for my stereo system.
 
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