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Vintage Mice for the first IBM Computer's and Clones

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gerrydoire

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Did IBM ever release a Mouse for this Card: IBM 33F4461 8525 Bus Mouse Card 8-Bit.
 
I don't remember that card being announced in the UK but going by its vintage it would have used a standard IBM PS/2 mouse. (PS/2 code name: Varmint.)
 
I think that the final bus mouse releases were actually PS/2 port adapters on a card instead of all the specialized bus mouse ports from before. But the ebay pictures that have that model number show up as the 8-pin bus mouse port which I think means Logitech mouse.
 
Despite having a Mini-DIN connector this card (http://www.recycledgoods.com/products/IBM-33F4461-8525-Bus-Mouse-Card-8-Bit-ISA-Vintage.html) doesn't look like a mouse interface card at all :)

1. It is way too big and it has way too many ICs for a mouse interface, even for 80's.
2. There are some audio / analog components present on this cards (LM386-1 amplifier just by the Mini-DIN connector), TSP5220 (apparently a speech synthesizer IC), MC3418 (Continuously Variable Slope Delta Modulator/Demodulator), a couple op amplifiers.

So it is more likely that this card is an audio / speech card, than a mouse interface.
 
krebizfan said:
I think that the final bus mouse releases were actually PS/2 port adapters on a card instead of all the specialized bus mouse ports from before.
Click to expand...

Do you have any idea which? I'd love to get a ISA PS/2 mouse adaptor, I was unaware any existed.
 
Not sure what problem we are trying to solve here.

- If it is finding and connecting a mouse to a PC/XT class computer - the best choice is a serial mouse. (Even if you don't have an available serial port, it shouldn't be difficult to find a serial port card). Some early Logitech and Microsoft PS/2 mice were serial port compatible, that used a passive adapter to connect to a serial port. These adapters didn't convert the PS/2 protocol to the serial one, they are simply two connectors wired together. The dual protocol support was implemented in the mouse itself.

- If it is about that IBM card mentioned at the beginning of the thread - No it doesn't look like a mouse controller card. See my post above :)

- If it is about connecting a PS/2 mouse to a PC/XT computer - I haven't seen a mouse controller card that would support PS/2 mouse. And even if it was one (as krebizfan suggested above) probably you'll have hard time finding a driver for that. There is no way it could be 100% compatible with PS/2 mouse implementation (PS/2 uses ports 60h/64h - shared with keyboard controller and implemented on the motherboard. PS/2 uses IRQ 12, which is not available on PC/XT. PS/2 mouse requires BIOS support).
 
IBM put PS/2 ports into the XT class PS/2 Model 25 and 30 so others could have done it as well. I should have noticed that the card in the first post was off because the 8525 is the model 25 and doesn't need an expansion card for mouse.

Bus mice have the problem that the people salvaging cards aren't salvaging the matching mice making it very difficult to get a working set. There were several different connectors used on bus mouse cards so sometimes the mouse won't plug in. Only buy a complete set of mouse and card.
 
vwestlife said:
The Tandy 1000RL is also an XT class machine (9.54 MHz 8086) with PS/2 mouse and keyboard ports.
Click to expand...

Do these machines have the 2nd 8259 IRQ controller on the motherboard? That would solve the IRQ 12 "problem".
 
njroadfan said:
Do these machines have the 2nd 8259 IRQ controller on the motherboard? That would solve the IRQ 12 "problem".
Click to expand...

No, and in fact the addresses used by the Tandy sound chip conflicted with those that would be used by the second IRQ controller, which is why the 286-based Tandy 1000 models still only had 8-bit ISA slots, and were not considered to be AT-class machines. When Tandy finally added 16-bit ISA slots to the 386SX-based 1000RSX, they moved the sound chip to a different address range, which broke compatibility with a lot of existing Tandy software.

One web post claims that the PS/2 mouse on the 1000RL uses IRQ 3, but I'm unable to confirm that. Norton Utilities, PC Tools, and Quarterdeck Manifest all don't identify which IRQ the mouse is using, and MSD locks up when trying to open the IRQ Status screen.
 
If anyone has the following, I'm looking to buy:

First Microsoft Inport Mouse NIB.

:)
 
There's a reason I just use Serial mice... It's why my 'weapon of choice' -- the original Logitech Trackman Marble -- is one of those wonderful units that's got a PS/2 port, but also works with (and originally came with) the PS/2 to Serial connectors.

Though I do often wish the modern equivalent -- the wireless M570, had more options than just USB.

Back in the day I wondered just what the devil you even needed a proprietary port and/or card for on something as simple as a mouse -- what with multi I/O cards being a dime a dozen and four standard COM ports available... Hell, I don't think I even started using PS/2 mice on PS/2 ports until they started integrating it into motherboards on clones (so... '97-ish?) since prior to that nothing I owned even had the port.
 
deathshadow said:
There's a reason I just use Serial mice... It's why my 'weapon of choice' -- the original Logitech Trackman Marble -- is one of those wonderful units that's got a PS/2 port, but also works with (and originally came with) the PS/2 to Serial connectors.

Though I do often wish the modern equivalent -- the wireless M570, had more options than just USB.

Back in the day I wondered just what the devil you even needed a proprietary port and/or card for on something as simple as a mouse -- what with multi I/O cards being a dime a dozen and four standard COM ports available... Hell, I don't think I even started using PS/2 mice on PS/2 ports until they started integrating it into motherboards on clones (so... '97-ish?) since prior to that nothing I owned even had the port.
Click to expand...

I've got that same mouse - had since the 90's and its been working ever since. Made in the USA, imagine that.
 
vwestlife said:
No, and in fact the addresses used by the Tandy sound chip conflicted with those that would be used by the second IRQ controller, which is why the 286-based Tandy 1000 models still only had 8-bit ISA slots, and were not considered to be AT-class machines. When Tandy finally added 16-bit ISA slots to the 386SX-based 1000RSX, they moved the sound chip to a different address range, which broke compatibility with a lot of existing Tandy software.

One web post claims that the PS/2 mouse on the 1000RL uses IRQ 3, but I'm unable to confirm that. Norton Utilities, PC Tools, and Quarterdeck Manifest all don't identify which IRQ the mouse is using, and MSD locks up when trying to open the IRQ Status screen.
Click to expand...

Its the second DMA controller, not the second IRQ controller. The fault lies with IBM, which put the sound chip at C0-C7 in the IBM PCjr. (of which the Tandy 1000 was a clone) and the 2nd DMA controller at C0-DF in the IBM PC AT. The mouse port in the RL must use IRQ3 by process of elimination.
 
Unknown IBM 8 bit Card with a like Bus Mouse Connector

Unknown IBM 8 bit Card with a like Bus Mouse Connector

sergey said:
Despite having a Mini-DIN connector this card (http://www.recycledgoods.com/products/IBM-33F4461-8525-Bus-Mouse-Card-8-Bit-ISA-Vintage.html) doesn't look like a mouse interface card at all :)

1. It is way too big and it has way too many ICs for a mouse interface, even for 80's.
2. There are some audio / analog components present on this cards (LM386-1 amplifier just by the Mini-DIN connector), TSP5220 (apparently a speech synthesizer IC), MC3418 (Continuously Variable Slope Delta Modulator/Demodulator), a couple op amplifiers.

So it is more likely that this card is an audio / speech card, than a mouse interface.
Click to expand...

One of the chips on the boards sais 1989, so this can't be a bus mouse card or IBM lost their mind.

The Card as you say has way to many chips for a bus mouse card even though the connector
on the card looks like it's for a bus mouse.

On the card the following IBM stamp 33F4461 XM

Be interesting to see what this sucker is.. :confused:
 
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