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web-surfing on windows 3.1: Any good winsocks?

carangil

Experienced Member
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Jun 3, 2009
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285
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Oakland, CA
Yeah, after browsing around with it for a little while, it is rather horrific.

My main intention to getting internet up on it was mostly to get TCP/IP working. Now I can FTP files to/from my other computers, instead of burning a cd / copying a floppy every time. It's also good enough for AIM (1.0!) and IRC.
 

wolfie

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Jul 1, 2009
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ontario
i have 2 486's running windows 98. they don't run too bad with win 98. i was using one of them as a web server 3 months ago. i had to use vnc because i couldn't get a mouse to work.
 

southbird

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Sep 11, 2009
Messages
316
"Yeah, that Windows 98 is pretty amazing. Of course, I can't get a mouse working, but still, amazing." :)
 

wolfie

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ontario
What server software did you use under 98?? :eek:
i used Apache HTTP Server 2.0.63. funny enough i had to turn the computer on to find out lol.
"Yeah, that Windows 98 is pretty amazing. Of course, I can't get a mouse working, but still, amazing." :)
i use an optical usb mouse on my other 486 and it works great. i don't think my com ports work on the one 486.
 

carangil

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I have been considering making my system dual boot. Either win 95 and dos or dos and Linux. I have not yet decided which quote to go. I already have a nice win 98 and Linux macine set up, so it would almost be redundent.

How much ram did you have in your win 98 machines, and what speed were they?
 

wolfie

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Jul 1, 2009
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ontario
i had 64mb of ram in the one i used for server and i think there is 36mb in the other. the server had 100mhz and the other had a 66mhz dx2.
since i had the server fired up i'm going to leave it on for a bit. heres a link http://486.ath.cx:81/
 
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southbird

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Sep 11, 2009
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316
i use an optical usb mouse on my other 486 and it works great. i don't think my com ports work on the one 486.

I was just teasing if you couldn't tell ... I've had various issues with hardware under 98, but I don't think a mouse was ever one of them! Also was reminded of Bash #724316
 

wolfie

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ontario
I was just teasing if you couldn't tell ... I've had various issues with hardware under 98, but I don't think a mouse was ever one of them! Also was reminded of Bash #724316
i knew you where just teasing. i know windows aint the greatest but i am not too familiar with the other older OS's. i've never had a problem with a mouse as long as it was plugged into a ps2 or usb port. now com ports is a totally different story. i've had alot of problems with com ports. i have learned my way around a keyboard pretty good:cool:.
 

wolfie

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ontario
If you have the right OS (win98 or linux), does USB even work on a 486? My guess is on a PCI bus 486 it might; but is there such a thing as an ISA/VLB usb card?

(Interesting enough, I did find the opposite: http://www.arstech.com/item--usb2isar.html )
this is what i use for my mouse on my 486. i don't know if it would work for anything else. my server is the only 486 i have ever found with pci slots. i don't think they are as common.
images
 
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ZOBEX

Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2009
Messages
37
You realize what this means don't you ?? You can run your MFM or RLL hard drive off a USB port.



this is what i use for my mouse on my 486. i don't know if it would work for anything else. my server is the only 486 i have ever found with pci slots. i don't think they are as common.
images
 

krebizfan

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May 23, 2009
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Connecticut
If you have the right OS (win98 or linux), does USB even work on a 486? My guess is on a PCI bus 486 it might; but is there such a thing as an ISA/VLB usb card?

There were several ISA USB cards manufactured. The only one I could find a current link to is http://www.simtec.co.uk/products/EB1161ISA/

I have no idea if this or any of the competing designs I recall will work with a given OS or hardware. Never tried it and the price quoted to me was enough that buying new systems was more cost effective.
 

Lord Moz

Experienced Member
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Oct 20, 2009
Messages
217
Location
Texas
I have a 286 which I'd like to get online. Running DOS 5 or 6.22 (I forget) and Win3.1 (WfW 3.11 needs a 386).

Actually, WfW3.11 works just fine on a 286, as I have done this myself. You just need to get a copy of win.com from win3.1 and copy it into the wfw3.11 installation. It's a hack, but it works. Obviously, the 286 won't support 386 enhanced mode, but there are plenty of programs (probably most) that work fine in regular protected mode.

I'm sure there is a way to modify wfw3.11's win.com, but at the time (lots of years ago) I found it easier to just use a win.com from a win3.1 install.

If I remember correctly, each time you run windows setup, it rebuilds win.com according to your current configuration, so you should probably have the wfw installation match the 286's as close as you can before you copy the win.com over.

If you want to try and need any help, just let me know.

Good luck ;)
 

carangil

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Oakland, CA
Actually, WfW3.11 works just fine on a 286, as I have done this myself. You just need to get a copy of win.com from win3.1 and copy it into the wfw3.11 installation.

Does anyone know if the TCP/IP drivers included in WfW 3.11 will run in 'standard mode?'
 

kishy

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Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Messages
1,065
Location
Windsor, ON Canada
I thought I'd post an update:

I got the ethernet card working with Trumpet. I was using the wrong version if WINPKT (I thought there was only one WINPKT shim in existence; the first one I tried was not trumpet compatible).

It is much faster than ppp/serial!

The card I am using is the 3com 3c509b-tp.

Here is the good news for you: http://support.3com.com/infodeli/inotes/techtran/30fa_5ea.htm
It will work on a 286! I'm not sure if Trumpet (or any other winsock) will work well/at all on a 286, but at least you could get DOS stuff going.
I got my card from http://www.weirdstuff.com/cgi-bin/item/11035
I think on a 286 that would be the way to go, since serial PPP seems to eat up a lot of CPU.

OO I HAVE AN ETHERLINK III SOMEWHERE!
(going hunting for it...now...)

3C5090-TPO

Now, I do have a D-Link card installed currently that has support for 3.1 if I recall correctly...I just have to find that ISA config utility that came with it since it's a PnP card but can be configured by software in non-PnP systems.

Actually, WfW3.11 works just fine on a 286, as I have done this myself. You just need to get a copy of win.com from win3.1 and copy it into the wfw3.11 installation. It's a hack, but it works. Obviously, the 286 won't support 386 enhanced mode, but there are plenty of programs (probably most) that work fine in regular protected mode.

I'm sure there is a way to modify wfw3.11's win.com, but at the time (lots of years ago) I found it easier to just use a win.com from a win3.1 install.

If I remember correctly, each time you run windows setup, it rebuilds win.com according to your current configuration, so you should probably have the wfw installation match the 286's as close as you can before you copy the win.com over.

If you want to try and need any help, just let me know.

Good luck ;)

Hmm...I will try this eventually, but if I can get 3.1 working appropriately I won't bother.
 

carangil

Experienced Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
285
Location
Oakland, CA
My card was also PnP. It was easily configurable through the EtherDisk Utility. The latest DOS-Happy version seems to be EtherDisk 6.0 (If you can't find it, get EtherDisk 6.1: Disc 2 of this set is EtherDisk 6.0! 3com has all this stuff still up for download.)

(Also, my SB16 is PnP. The Creative PnP manager seems to coexist OK with the 3com one. I was really worries about it at first, ISA PnP sometimes seems like the computer industry's 'beta test' for PCI PnP. )

Other notes:

-You only need to run the 3com configuration once: once you set the IRQ and such, and disable PnP, the card will remember the values. (At least my model did.) (Which is convenient, because my SB16 doesn't remember anything; I need to load the reconfigurer every boot in autoexec.)

-You don't need to install any of the 3com netware nwclient or windows support stuff. Just copy PKTDVR somewhere.

-To use PKTDVR in Windows, you need WINPKT. There seems to be different versions of this file. Since I am using Trumpet, I used the Trumpet version. Which version are you intending on using?

-If you have WFW3.11, there is a native windows driver for this card on the etherdisk, but it's 386+ only, sorry :-(

BTW: I'm temporarily solved my trumpet problem by screwing with the date on my system. (But this is stupid, haha.)
 

ZOBEX

Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2009
Messages
37
i have not a clue what you mean. i would sooner just install another internal hard drive.

It's not a question of is it practical, as why would anyone still work with XT to 486. It's a question of will it work. Since MFM is self contained in the HD with the ISA controller and since the working unit is addressed via USB as a working unit, a USB connection should be able to talk to the HD and controller card on the end of the USB connection. It's an exercise in engineering.
 
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