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What do you use your computer for?
- Thread starter ppo
- Start date
- There is an old 'outline processor' program for DOS called PC-Outline by Brown Bag Software that I absolutely love to use. At outline processor is designed for writing and organizing outlines, similar to what a word processor does in 'outline' mode. However, this program did it absolutely right. I'm sure it would run on a modern machine in DOSBox, but my modern machines have instant messengers, web browsers, IRC clients, email notifications, etc. If I really need to concentrate I turn on an old machine (usually a PCjr) and escape the distractions.
- Hardware hacking. You can't do hardware hacking in DOSBox.
http://brutman.com/pics/PCjr_WD_small.jpg
- Serial device debugging. If I'm working with an old serial port device and I can't get it working on a modern machine, I'll revert back to an ancient DOS machine. That simplifies the problem - I know there is no operating system getting in the way, no other software interfering, and I've been using the same software (Procomm 2.4.3) for over 20 years now so I know what to expect.
I have found Realterm (http://realterm.sourceforge.net/) to be a good modern equivalent, so I might stop doing this unless the USB serial adapters are dodgy. - Cataloging/archiving/preserving old diskettes. I have a lot of 5.25" diskettes to go through, and I want to run DOS to avoid interference with Windows. Also, my Central Point Option Board runs on an old 386, and it is really timing sensitive. I have to dumb a 386-40 down to 8mhz and turn off all of the speed features in the BIOS setup to make it work. The card is worth it ...
Maverick1978
Veteran Member
I enjoy playing with and configuring the old computer hardware - for me, it's much the same as with my old videogame hardware. There's much more satisfaction in being able to add-on, hack, tear apart, and otherwise personalize a system that you don't exactly get with modern systems unless you have a major electronics background - which I'm lacking. The exception (to my mind) being with the homebrew hacks and exploits on the Wii. It's the closest "modern" system I can think of that captures the vintage spirit...and maybe that's just because I'm a Nintendo 80's kid.
I also like to catalog/archive/preserve software, for me, specifically gaming software and interesting utilities. I try to collect them in their original forms, I archive the boxes/manuals/inserts/floppies in at least 300dpi, I image the floppies, and then back everything up. Eventually I'm not going to be able to store everything anymore... so it'll be nice to have a digital archive of everything. Incidently, I just acquired of a Central Point Option Board Deluxe that slid under the radar on eBay as the guy called it by "Transcopy" - the name on the primary chip. I'll be placing it inside of my IBM AT once I get it fully operational, as I dont think that my IBM 486DX4-100 will be able to run it because of timing issues.
And uh, I like to play games. DOSBox annoys. I dislike having to adjust the frame rate and cpu settings just to enjoy an old game in the way it was meant to be enjoyed for the brief 10-20 free minutes that I have. Much easier to just pop it in an old machine and play, not to mention more authentic of an experience.
I also like to catalog/archive/preserve software, for me, specifically gaming software and interesting utilities. I try to collect them in their original forms, I archive the boxes/manuals/inserts/floppies in at least 300dpi, I image the floppies, and then back everything up. Eventually I'm not going to be able to store everything anymore... so it'll be nice to have a digital archive of everything. Incidently, I just acquired of a Central Point Option Board Deluxe that slid under the radar on eBay as the guy called it by "Transcopy" - the name on the primary chip. I'll be placing it inside of my IBM AT once I get it fully operational, as I dont think that my IBM 486DX4-100 will be able to run it because of timing issues.
And uh, I like to play games.
DOSBox annoys. I dislike having to adjust the frame rate and cpu settings just to enjoy an old game in the way it was meant to be enjoyed for the brief 10-20 free minutes that I have. Much easier to just pop it in an old machine and play, not to mention more authentic of an experience.Dave Farquhar
Experienced Member
Right now, hardware hacking. I'm loading up an old box with parallel port adapters so I can control lights on a model train layout with a QBASIC program. I may end up using a Pentium (not quite vintage, I know) because then I can use PCI cards in addition to ISA, and have as many ports as I have slots. If it weren't for that, even a 4.77 MHz PC or XT would be overkill for this job.
This particular job is much, much simpler in DOS than in modern operating systems. And PCs that lack the power necessary to run Windows XP are cheap, cheap, cheap.
But besides that, I like to tinker, and the older machines generally are easier to tinker with than modern systems. Particularly with an 8-bit system, it's possible to know almost all there is to know about the system.
This particular job is much, much simpler in DOS than in modern operating systems. And PCs that lack the power necessary to run Windows XP are cheap, cheap, cheap.
But besides that, I like to tinker, and the older machines generally are easier to tinker with than modern systems. Particularly with an 8-bit system, it's possible to know almost all there is to know about the system.
Mr.Amiga500
Experienced Member
I used to do much more with vintage computers, but lately I've been having difficulty justifying the time wasted screwing around to get them working properly. So now, I just focus on a few computers that do certain things well.
Amiga 3000 - mostly browsing, email, file transfer to SD card (for TRS-80 Model 100 & Atari 800XL), backup/transfer for other Amigas. I'm now playing with terminal program - connecting to other old computers like Kaypro, Apple II.
Amiga 500 - my all-time favourite vintage computer. It's about twice the speed of my A3000, but unfortunately no Ethernet or USB. Dial-up is too slow and unreliable now, so I stopped using it for internet & email. I now mainly use it for text editing, occasional image editing, music and games (bit of a "Settlers" obsession at the moment). I used to do much more, but not lately.
TRS-80 Model 100 - writing text. It's my only (truly) portable vintage computer and it has a nice keyboard & turns on/off instantly - so it's great for typing stuff wherever I want. I tried making useful BASIC programs, but the BASIC is too damn slow.
Before I got the Model 100, I was typing stuff on the 800XL (and playing games), but the Model 100 is so much easier to transfer text. I also hoped to make some use from my Kaypros - because I love the screens and keyboards - but I have no software, no mass storage and no easy way to transfer what I type (except maybe serial transfer to Amiga - which I'm testing at the moment).
Amiga 3000 - mostly browsing, email, file transfer to SD card (for TRS-80 Model 100 & Atari 800XL), backup/transfer for other Amigas. I'm now playing with terminal program - connecting to other old computers like Kaypro, Apple II.
Amiga 500 - my all-time favourite vintage computer. It's about twice the speed of my A3000, but unfortunately no Ethernet or USB. Dial-up is too slow and unreliable now, so I stopped using it for internet & email. I now mainly use it for text editing, occasional image editing, music and games (bit of a "Settlers" obsession at the moment). I used to do much more, but not lately.
TRS-80 Model 100 - writing text. It's my only (truly) portable vintage computer and it has a nice keyboard & turns on/off instantly - so it's great for typing stuff wherever I want. I tried making useful BASIC programs, but the BASIC is too damn slow.
Before I got the Model 100, I was typing stuff on the 800XL (and playing games), but the Model 100 is so much easier to transfer text. I also hoped to make some use from my Kaypros - because I love the screens and keyboards - but I have no software, no mass storage and no easy way to transfer what I type (except maybe serial transfer to Amiga - which I'm testing at the moment).
My old computer now vintage is a Z80 based system that I built chip by chip. It has several par. and serial ports and a screen Green 9" ,floppies and hard drive All of the OS is personally hand written and is not DOS or CP/M related in any way and is of my own creation. Well I simply love designing new circuits and writing programs to make them work so that is what I do with mine. always learning (in my case relearning) something.
I've had this system now for at least 25 years and I know every chip and every byte of software in it intimetly. I also have 3 Kaypros and I do the same thing on them as well!
Theres something about doing everything for myself that I find so attractive in this and it's not like everything is done for me and (the wrong way) like it is now adays. so writing software for these systems is wide open and I can build what ever I think of and it's not industry standard, but what has that gotten society except updating constantly. Hell I was guilty of it getting new hardware and software to be current in speed and the best , until i realized that I'm just feeding the bad habits of the manufacturers by buying all of that crapy made software and bug riden computers of these days. Sorry to rant there , but you get the idea!
So for me it's just doing what I want with it and not having the system getting in the way all of the time. I am always pushing the system to the limit to see what I can make it do and how far it will go before it chokes up.
z8coder
I've had this system now for at least 25 years and I know every chip and every byte of software in it intimetly. I also have 3 Kaypros and I do the same thing on them as well!
Theres something about doing everything for myself that I find so attractive in this and it's not like everything is done for me and (the wrong way) like it is now adays. so writing software for these systems is wide open and I can build what ever I think of and it's not industry standard, but what has that gotten society except updating constantly. Hell I was guilty of it getting new hardware and software to be current in speed and the best , until i realized that I'm just feeding the bad habits of the manufacturers by buying all of that crapy made software and bug riden computers of these days. Sorry to rant there , but you get the idea!
So for me it's just doing what I want with it and not having the system getting in the way all of the time. I am always pushing the system to the limit to see what I can make it do and how far it will go before it chokes up.
z8coder
strollin
Experienced Member
I don't "do" anything with my vintage computers. Anything I need/want to do can be done faster and better on modern equipment. I like to tinker with my vintage machines for nostalgic reasons only.
Ole Juul
Veteran Member
I'm half like that.
I don't do much with my old stuff either. Some of it is not set up, some is just historical boards and parts, a few systems get looked at occasionally just for the challenge. My connection to the VCF is that I like to collect and preserve, and ...I am very much a fan of minimal computing.
I do use some old stuff on a regular basis. I like to write, collect, and manage ideas in text format. I have yet to see a modern system that can do that as effectively and intuitively as a DOS system. Linux is useless for that stuff - and yes I use it a lot on the command line - but it doesn't have the basic facility because it doesn't have the software written for it. Many DOS utilities were written at a time when there weren't a lot of distractions from text mode. Because of that, I have two "main" systems: an opensource/*nix box and a DOS machine. The two are integrated by TCP/IP and shared screen and keyboard.
In short, I use an old DOS system because some of what I need/want to do can actually be done faster and better on that equipment. I'm with Mike Brutman in that, to me, there are indeed some advantages to old stuff, and there are a couple of utilities which I can't/won't do without. TSRs in general and DM.COM in particular.
NathanAllan
Veteran Member
Most of my vintage stuff is set up for games, but occasionally I have a neat piece come my way so I have something to test it on. There's plenty here for that, Tandys, Commodores, Ataris, old PC's, but I am lacking on Apples. I need an Apple ][ but I just did get a cable to hook up the ImageWriter to a PC.
Whenever I get a new addition and I can print from it, I write a letter to somebody just to do it.
Whenever I get a new addition and I can print from it, I write a letter to somebody just to do it.
I hook up my vintage machines mainly just to see and make sure they still run well. I do play at writing BASIC programs for them, but nothing long or involved. When I bought several of the machines, for my collection, that I 'always wanted' back in the 80's - I thought I'd be digging out my old COMPUTE! mags and typing in those magazine programs like I did back in the day on my VIC-20 and C-64. Alas, I haven't done that at all! In reality, I'm spoiled by today's computers. Back in the 80's, I got a kick out of all those 'type 'em in yourself' games and utilities. Not today though! I don't want to spend the time nor do I have the inclination for typing in something like this anymore!
I really don't know how we did it. I must have spent a million hours to accomplish so little. Yet there is nostalgia in it all, still It's fun to remember, fun to look at, but I'm not about to repeat the procedure again. If you've ever waited for a 'big' program to load or save from a cassette tape, you'll know where I'm coming from.
It's a funny thing about 'things' that are nostalgic to us all. What nostalgia seems to be and do is to strip off all the bad memories and leave just the good. Perhaps you worked hard putting a clutch in an old car of yours, when you were young, and saved a ton of money. You 'remember' the accomplishment and the good feeling, but you forget how hot the day was, and you sweated your guts out and tore your knuckles raw - you forget that part Ah, the sweet beauty of 'nostalgia'.
I really don't know how we did it. I must have spent a million hours to accomplish so little. Yet there is nostalgia in it all, still It's fun to remember, fun to look at, but I'm not about to repeat the procedure again. If you've ever waited for a 'big' program to load or save from a cassette tape, you'll know where I'm coming from.
It's a funny thing about 'things' that are nostalgic to us all. What nostalgia seems to be and do is to strip off all the bad memories and leave just the good. Perhaps you worked hard putting a clutch in an old car of yours, when you were young, and saved a ton of money. You 'remember' the accomplishment and the good feeling, but you forget how hot the day was, and you sweated your guts out and tore your knuckles raw - you forget that part
Ah, the sweet beauty of 'nostalgia'.mikerm
Experienced Member
That looks like a modern svga monitor, how did you get your 128 on that?
I use that one monitor for all my computers, modern or vintage.
Easily done by going through a video capture card.
See my photo albums here for other examples - a picture being worth 1k words
http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/album.php?albumid=1&page=2
carangil
Experienced Member
Well, for me I mostly use my old computers for games, but the company I used to work for used vintage computer peripherals in an actual test & measurement setting!
In the 80's this company bought a commodore 128 and a coco. They used the coco to run a EPROM programmer, and they continued to use this until the mid 90's. When they finally retired it, it was put in the closet. When I was leaving the company, they were also cleaning out some old junk, and they let me take it (And thats how I got my coco!)
The commodore 128 was used because it's serial port is ieee 488, which is also known as GPIB. A lot of industrial control and measurement devices run on a GPIB bus, so the commodore was a logical choice for them. They also used the C128 until the late 90's. (I didn't start the company until 2006, so a lot of this story is second-hand.) They ported their BASIC program to Visual basic, and started running GPIB through a PCI-card. However, their original C128 program printed charts using low-level raw commands through a serial plotter. Instead of printing on a PC's native printer, they decided to port the plotter logic. They kept the old pen plotter, and connected it to their PC through some sloppy adapter they made by splicing up some cables. So, when I joined the company in 2007, they were still printing their charts with this 25 year old pen-plotter hot wired to the back of a 10-year old PC! The PC was running windows 95, but the program was written in a windows 3.x version of VB.
In the 80's this company bought a commodore 128 and a coco. They used the coco to run a EPROM programmer, and they continued to use this until the mid 90's. When they finally retired it, it was put in the closet. When I was leaving the company, they were also cleaning out some old junk, and they let me take it (And thats how I got my coco!)
The commodore 128 was used because it's serial port is ieee 488, which is also known as GPIB. A lot of industrial control and measurement devices run on a GPIB bus, so the commodore was a logical choice for them. They also used the C128 until the late 90's. (I didn't start the company until 2006, so a lot of this story is second-hand.) They ported their BASIC program to Visual basic, and started running GPIB through a PCI-card. However, their original C128 program printed charts using low-level raw commands through a serial plotter. Instead of printing on a PC's native printer, they decided to port the plotter logic. They kept the old pen plotter, and connected it to their PC through some sloppy adapter they made by splicing up some cables. So, when I joined the company in 2007, they were still printing their charts with this 25 year old pen-plotter hot wired to the back of a 10-year old PC! The PC was running windows 95, but the program was written in a windows 3.x version of VB.
Mr.Amiga500
Experienced Member
I've just found a new use for my Amiga 3000 - copying music to MP3 player. That might not sound like much, but I think it's pretty amazing for a 20 year old computer - and it's one of the things I always wanted to do on my Amiga.
I was surprised when I plugged the Sansa Clip+ in the Amiga USB and the disk icon immediately showed up on the desktop. I found the folder "Music", copied an MP3, unplugged the USB and played the music on the player. (something I can't do with my iPod, thanks to Apple deliberately preventing easy music transfer)
What's left that the Amiga can't do? (don't mention Flash video - the iPad can't do that either)
I was surprised when I plugged the Sansa Clip+ in the Amiga USB and the disk icon immediately showed up on the desktop. I found the folder "Music", copied an MP3, unplugged the USB and played the music on the player. (something I can't do with my iPod, thanks to Apple deliberately preventing easy music transfer)
What's left that the Amiga can't do? (don't mention Flash video - the iPad can't do that either
)tezza
Veteran Member
Yes, me too. And to make sure they are running ok. I'll often turn a couple of units on for about 6 hours on the weekend and just let them cycle through a RAM test. Eventually I'd like to display them.
Tez
tezza
Veteran Member
You are definitely right there. I did a BASIC speed face-off with my NEC 8021a and the NEC won hands down. I believe the reason is because the Model 100 BASIC is double-precision by default. I imagine using the DEFSNG command for all integers used would speed things up a bit.
Tez