Chuck(G)
25k Member
Count the conductors in the cable--there should be 34, not 40. 40 is for IDE drives.
- VCF South West - June 14 - 16, Davidson-Gundy Alumni Center at University of Texas at Dallas
- VCF West - Aug 2 - 3, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, CA
- VCF Midwest - Sept 7 - 8 2024, Schaumburg, IL
- VCF SoCal - Mid February 2025, Location TBD, Southern CA
- VCF East - April 2025, Infoage Museum, Wall NJ
-
Please review our updated Terms and Rules here
TRS80 - Model 4 disk error
- Thread starter Lorne
- Start date
Count the conductors in the cable--there should be 34, not 40. 40 is for IDE drives.
Lorne
Veteran Member
chuckcmagee
Veteran Member
They will. My full sized Gateway tower is using one of those cables as I type. Hooked up to a 5.25" 360K drive even. I am still looking for my 3.31 diskettes. They got pu somewhere and of course, I can't remember where. The Gateway almost boots from the 3.31 floppy but is getting read errors late in the game, which is why I am looking all over the place for another copy.
When you get them, the far end with the 2 connectors on it is for the A drive, the middle 2 are for the B drive and the other end goes to the FDC.
When you get them, the far end with the 2 connectors on it is for the A drive, the middle 2 are for the B drive and the other end goes to the FDC.
patscc
Veteran Member
Bios
Bios
If you plan on hooking the 5.25 from the TRS up to the Vectra, make sure you set the drive to 360k in the BIOS.
patscc
Bios
If you plan on hooking the 5.25 from the TRS up to the Vectra, make sure you set the drive to 360k in the BIOS.
patscc
Terry Yager
Veteran Member
patscc
Veteran Member
BIOS pt. 2
BIOS pt. 2
It should still work on 360, at least to see if the drive works. I can't remember if you need to load a patch to 'fix' the parameter block so that DOS sees only 1 side, or what.
patscc
BIOS pt. 2
But most BIOS have 360, 1.2, 720, and 1.44 as settings.
It should still work on 360, at least to see if the drive works. I can't remember if you need to load a patch to 'fix' the parameter block so that DOS sees only 1 side, or what.
patscc
Chuck(G)
25k Member
If you're running MS-DOS 6.22 or earlier,
FORMAT A: /1 should do the trick if it's been set as a 360K drive.
FORMAT A: /1 should do the trick if it's been set as a 360K drive.
patscc
Veteran Member
media type
media type
And the BPB on the boot record then subsequently tells DOS it's single-sided, right ?
For re-imaging stuff like CP/M disks, though, this shouldn't matter, right ? As long as the BIOS is set to 360k so the controller doesn't start treating the drive as a 1.2 Mb.
I'm wondering, should floppy drive seek in the BIOS be turned on as well, or is it redundant due to the 360k setting ?
patscc
media type
And the BPB on the boot record then subsequently tells DOS it's single-sided, right ?
For re-imaging stuff like CP/M disks, though, this shouldn't matter, right ? As long as the BIOS is set to 360k so the controller doesn't start treating the drive as a 1.2 Mb.
I'm wondering, should floppy drive seek in the BIOS be turned on as well, or is it redundant due to the 360k setting ?
patscc
Chuck(G)
25k Member
The BPB will tell DOS not to look for the second side.
Seek can be left either way in the BIOS setup. Just 360K 5.25" selection should be all that's necessary.
Seek can be left either way in the BIOS setup. Just 360K 5.25" selection should be all that's necessary.
tezza
Veteran Member
Lorne,
You might also consider checking the original boot disk with the program detailed here. http://www.trs-80emulators.com/readdisk_doc.html.
I haven't used it but from what I read, if the program can't read it, there is a good chance the disk is faulty. If it can, it's likely to be ok.
I'm assuming it is one of TRS-80 Dos'es (TRSDOS, LDOS?) rather than a cp/m disk yes?
Tez
You might also consider checking the original boot disk with the program detailed here. http://www.trs-80emulators.com/readdisk_doc.html.
I haven't used it but from what I read, if the program can't read it, there is a good chance the disk is faulty. If it can, it's likely to be ok.
I'm assuming it is one of TRS-80 Dos'es (TRSDOS, LDOS?) rather than a cp/m disk yes?
Tez
Lorne
Veteran Member
With patscc's help, I got the Vectra working. It wouldn't boot, so he had me remove the cache ram and reseat it, and then it booted just fine.
The only file on the Vectra's HDD is command.com, so I'll have to wait until I get the Windows and DOS disks (they're in the mail already).
The Vectra has an ethernet card, so once I load an OS, I'll give that readdisk a shot to make sure the boot disk (which is supposed to have both TRSDOS and LSDOS on it) is actually OK.
Lorne
Veteran Member
I just received the TRS-80 boot disks in the mail.
I asked Ira for Model IV boot disks, but he sent me 6 disks for Model III, and 6 disks for Model IV, just in case I wanted to access it in Model III mode as well.
That's 12 disks in total, containing TRSDOS v6.2.1-AR, MULTIDOS v2.2 & v5.11, DOSPLUS IV v1.0, LDOS v6.3.1 and a Superutility 4/4P disk, plus all the model III disks, and a couple of games disks as well.
All that for just requesting it. He didn't even ask me to pay for the disks or the postage !
What a good guy (Ira Goldklang - www.trs-80.com)
All Ira asks in return, is that if you're happy with them, you make a donation to his site.
I did.
Now, I think I'll wait until I test the FDDs in the PC, before I insert another DOS disk into the TRS-80.
Lorne
Veteran Member
I don't have the necessary cables yet, but I tried changing the BIOS on the Vectra to a 360K 5.25" setting, but i don't appaer to have the option.
In the Phoenix BIOS SEtup - Configuration - Flexible Disk Drives section, it shows A as 1.44 MB, 3 1/2", and B as 1.2 MB 5 1/4". If I try to change either of those, it just gives me the option of it being 1.44 MB or 1.2 MB. No 360 K.
Is that a function of the operating system? IE: does Windows 95 not support a 360 K, while DOS 6.22 might, or do I just have a PC and BIOS that is too new?
In the Phoenix BIOS SEtup - Configuration - Flexible Disk Drives section, it shows A as 1.44 MB, 3 1/2", and B as 1.2 MB 5 1/4". If I try to change either of those, it just gives me the option of it being 1.44 MB or 1.2 MB. No 360 K.
Is that a function of the operating system? IE: does Windows 95 not support a 360 K, while DOS 6.22 might, or do I just have a PC and BIOS that is too new?
Chuck(G)
25k Member
Nope, it's a function of your BIOS setup program.
However, here's an idea. Set the drive to 1.44MB mode, disable "seek on boot" (if that's an option).
Next unzip the file attached here and copy it onti to your hard disk into theroot directory. Edit your CONFIG.SYS file and add the following:
DEVICE=160DOS.SYS /D:0
Restart your machine into MS-DOS command prompt mode. While the system is booting, you should see a message to the effect of "160K DOS disk in unit 0 is accessible as drive G:" or whatever drive letter is available.
Do a FORMAT G: and watch the fun.
Sick, huh?
However, here's an idea. Set the drive to 1.44MB mode, disable "seek on boot" (if that's an option).
Next unzip the file attached here and copy it onti to your hard disk into theroot directory. Edit your CONFIG.SYS file and add the following:
DEVICE=160DOS.SYS /D:0
Restart your machine into MS-DOS command prompt mode. While the system is booting, you should see a message to the effect of "160K DOS disk in unit 0 is accessible as drive G:" or whatever drive letter is available.
Do a FORMAT G: and watch the fun.
Sick, huh?
Last edited:
Lorne
Veteran Member
OK - therein lies the problem.
The HP Vectra PC has a hard drive, a 3 1/2" and a 5 1/4". I have a spare optical drive, but it looks like the Vectra BIOS wouldn't let me hook that up either.
I can download the zip file to my desktop which has a hard drive and an optical drive, but no 3 1/2" or 5 1/4". (someone told me that either the new Dell computers or Windows XP doesn't even support floppies anymore).
Is that correct, or can I add a 3 1/2" to my new Dell desktop? It has a space for one.
The HP Vectra PC has a hard drive, a 3 1/2" and a 5 1/4". I have a spare optical drive, but it looks like the Vectra BIOS wouldn't let me hook that up either.
I can download the zip file to my desktop which has a hard drive and an optical drive, but no 3 1/2" or 5 1/4". (someone told me that either the new Dell computers or Windows XP doesn't even support floppies anymore).
Is that correct, or can I add a 3 1/2" to my new Dell desktop? It has a space for one.
patscc
Veteran Member
config.sys
config.sys
In case you don't have a config.sys on your hard drive, you can create on like this:
At the c:\ prompt, type:
copy con config.sys <enter>
DEVICE=160DOS.SYS /D:0 <enter>
ctrl-Z <enter>
The first line redirects the console to a file.
The second line is content.
The third line closes the file. (hold the ctrl key and type Z, then hit enter)
that'll create a config.sys if you don't already have one there.
patscc
config.sys
In case you don't have a config.sys on your hard drive, you can create on like this:
At the c:\ prompt, type:
copy con config.sys <enter>
DEVICE=160DOS.SYS /D:0 <enter>
ctrl-Z <enter>
The first line redirects the console to a file.
The second line is content.
The third line closes the file. (hold the ctrl key and type Z, then hit enter)
that'll create a config.sys if you don't already have one there.
patscc
Chuck(G)
25k Member
Vista even supports floppies--as does XP. I suspect that Dell being Dell, you can add a single 3.5" floppy to your system (the mobo should have a connector on it for floppy).
If no connector, just plug in a USB floppy drive. Not as flexible as the legacy floppies, but it'll read and write DOS format diskettes.
Lorne
Veteran Member
Those cables from Ebay arrived.
I got the last two that were shown in that auction but the guy told me he has:
I have a case left, about 40 to 50 cables.
Let me know what else you are looking for.
I have some old 486 and Pentium motherboards, AT cases still boxes, AT cases with some computer boards in them.
Some controller cards for RLL, maybe MFM some with cables, some without cables.
Some SCSI controller cards and the older 3.5 size SCSI drives.
I told him he should post them on our forum. Don't know if he will, but if anyone is interested in any of that stuff, PM me and I'll give you his contact info.
Lorne
Veteran Member
Update
Update
Update:
I got the universal floppy cables, loaded MS-DOS 6.22 onto the PC, and hooked up what was drive A in the TRS-80, to the drive A connector in the PC. Also got Chuck(G)'s 160DOS.sys file off my desktop hard and put it in the root directory of the hard drive in the PC.
I made a config.sys file containing "DEVICE=160DOS.SYS /D:0" as patscc suggested.
I booted the PC.
As Chuck(G) said it would, it gave me a message to the effect of "160K DOS disk in unit 0 is accessible as drive D".
I put a DSDD (not DS2HD) floppy into the drive, and did a format D:
It displayed:
Formatting 160 K
Format complete
Unable to write boot
Format terminated
(FYI: I also did a format D: /1 but then I got a message saying "formatting 180 K), and the following messages were the same as above).
I've taken three videos (each under 1 MB) of the drive stepping through its motions. The first when the heads started in the center of the disk, the next from the outside of the disk, and the last with the drives starting between the center and outside.
The heads don't seem to be able to cover the whole disk (ie: from center to outside).
If anyopne wants to view the videos, please PM me your email address and I'll email them to you as attachments.
Thanks,
Lorne.
Update
Update:
I got the universal floppy cables, loaded MS-DOS 6.22 onto the PC, and hooked up what was drive A in the TRS-80, to the drive A connector in the PC. Also got Chuck(G)'s 160DOS.sys file off my desktop hard and put it in the root directory of the hard drive in the PC.
I made a config.sys file containing "DEVICE=160DOS.SYS /D:0" as patscc suggested.
I booted the PC.
As Chuck(G) said it would, it gave me a message to the effect of "160K DOS disk in unit 0 is accessible as drive D".
I put a DSDD (not DS2HD) floppy into the drive, and did a format D:
It displayed:
Formatting 160 K
Format complete
Unable to write boot
Format terminated
(FYI: I also did a format D: /1 but then I got a message saying "formatting 180 K), and the following messages were the same as above).
I've taken three videos (each under 1 MB) of the drive stepping through its motions. The first when the heads started in the center of the disk, the next from the outside of the disk, and the last with the drives starting between the center and outside.
The heads don't seem to be able to cover the whole disk (ie: from center to outside).
If anyopne wants to view the videos, please PM me your email address and I'll email them to you as attachments.
Thanks,
Lorne.
patscc
Veteran Member
stepping
stepping
With a few wires you can jig something up to let you manually step through the steps and see if it's correctly moving the head. Let me know if you want to go that route.
I can't remember now, have the rails, or anything else on it been lubed ?
I guess after the format terminates, doing a DIR on the floppy gives an error ?
Did you try several floppies ?
patscc
stepping
With a few wires you can jig something up to let you manually step through the steps and see if it's correctly moving the head. Let me know if you want to go that route.
I can't remember now, have the rails, or anything else on it been lubed ?
I guess after the format terminates, doing a DIR on the floppy gives an error ?
Did you try several floppies ?
patscc