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Cheapo IDE interface for Model 4 running LS-DOS

A

Al Hartman

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Joined
Aug 13, 2013
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Keansburg, New Jersey, United States
Finally got around to making the cable for my cheapo IDE interface (http://www.lo-tech.co.uk/wiki/Lo-tech_TRS-80_IDE_Adapter_rev.2)

Making the floppy has been a bear.

I used the TRS32 emulator to boot the LD4-631.DSK image I downloaded from the Tim Mann website (http://tim-mann.org/misosys.html) and I used TRSTOOLS to create a blank 40trk DSDD LS-DOS DMK image. The original was SSDD and was a JV3 image which IMAGEDISK (http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/img/index.htm) can't work with.

Then, I copied the system over to it. And, tested that it booted. It worked fine.

I mounted the IDE.DSK image from the Lo-Tech website to copy the two driver file over. But, the image was password protected and wouldn't let me copy the files over within LS-DOS.

I had to use TRSTOOLS to extract the two files to my Windows 7 file system, and then import them into the new DSDD image. I rebooted the image, and the files are there.

Next, I copy the disk image to a floppy in my USB 3.5" floppy drive. I run Virtual PC with an MS-DOS 5.0 virtual machine, andconvert the disk image from DMK to IMD using the DMK2IMD program. I have to do it this way, because if I try to do the conversion on my 5150, the image it makes is unusable.

Now, I take the IMD image to my 5150 and use IMAGEDISK to write it out to a floppy.

I have to go do the last two paragraphs now. I'll post back in awhile with the results.
 
Should have worked, but didn't. The resulting disk won't boot, and I can't even get a directory of it from another booted DOS (Using MultiDos CAT command).

I'm stuck because none of the software provided is in a format I can make a disk from.

Can someone make an IMAGEDISK image of an LS-DOS 6 boot disk with the driver files on it for me?

I'm pretty much stuck.
 
It would help if that were in the documentation that comes with the drivers. How would I know that?

I am not an L-DOS/LS-DOS user at all. Never used it back in the day, and only using it now to see if my adapter works.

I really need IMAGEDISK images of the drivers and the boot disks. While the images I create work fine in the emulator, DMK2IMD mangles them and turns them into junk. I think it's a problem with TRSTOOLS where I'm creating the images.
 
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Al Hartman said:
I think it's a problem with TRSTOOLS where I'm creating the images.
Click to expand...

Indeed. I'm a paid, registered user of his Model 4 emulator. It won't read the majority of the disk images on the web. It won't read images created by TRSTOOLS (which won't read many or the good images on the web). Garbage programming IMO.

Mike
 
i'm not having problems reading images in TRS32 or TRSTOOLS, but it seems that TRSTOOLS is not creating blank DMK images correctly.

I ran into a problem with the disk I was using to transfer the images over. Re-creating it now. I should know if I solved the problem shortly.
 
If there are deficiencies in the documentation for the Lo-Tech adapter, any help in improving that would be very much appreciated!
 
Well... One thing I would do is get images of the drivers on single-sided, double density, 40 track disks in IMAGEDISK format (http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/img/index.htm). The images provided are very difficult to get over to a physical disk. Imagedisk files are dead easy to write out to a floppy. Not every TRS-80 has double-sided drives.

I would appreciate an indication of which way to plug the cable into the bottom of the Model III/4. A picture showing which side is pin 1 would help.

I'm having A LOT of difficulty making the required floppies. My only available system to make TRS-80 5.25" floppies is a 5150 which can't run any of the DOS-based emulators.

I've made disks for my Model 4 from the IMAGEDISK images from Dave Dunfield's site. But, he only has TRS-DOS 1.3, not LS-DOS.

I built one of Sergey's FDC adapters and successfully made a bootable Model I Multidos disk. But, nothing I've tried has allowed me to make a bootable LS-DOS or L-DOS disk.
 
Ok, thanks, so if anyone with an adapter currently running is able to provide these, I'd be very keen to get the photo up on the wiki and the alternate disk images available. Specifically I need:

1. Photo of cable attached to 4 and 4/P machines, showing orientation some how.
2. Drivers represented as single-sided floppy images in IMAGEDISK format.

If you can provide either of these, please get in touch via PM. Many thanks!
 
Hey Al, good info here: http://www.tim-mann.org/trs80faq.html look at item 11 for all the passwords. James may want to link to this also?

And as far as making disks use an emulator! Best way. I use David Keils. and it acts like a real TRS-80. I also use an Adaptec 1542CF to write single density if needed. Otherwise the onboard controller should be ok. My emulator is run by a P1 at 233Mhz running DOS 6.22 and have a 1.44 a: drive and a 360KB b: drive. Also acts as a tweener system. :D

But FYI running an emulator you will need a 486 class system the faster the better or a Pentium class. It requires a decent amount of horse power. And stick with DOS only although
windows 9x can be used if so desired. No NT variants will work.
 
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Chromedome45 said:
And as far as making disks use an emulator! Best way. I use David Keils. and it acts like a real TRS-80. I also use an Adaptec 1542CF to write single density if needed. Otherwise the onboard controller should be ok. My emulator is run by a P1 at 233Mhz running DOS 6.22 and have a 1.44 a: drive and a 360KB b: drive. Also acts as a tweener system. :D

But FYI running an emulator you will need a 486 class system the faster the better or a Pentium class. It requires a decent amount of horse power. And stick with DOS only although windows 9x can be used if so desired. No NT variants will work.
Click to expand...

The only system I have available with a 360k drive is a 5150 PC which is WAY TOO SLOW to run any of the emulators, even with a V20 chip.

I have a 486 board here, but no case for it.

I built one of Sergey's FDC and Comm port Controllers (http://www.malinov.com/Home/sergeys-projects/isa-fdc-and-uart) which works great with Imagedisk on the 5150 to write Model I disks as well as allowing me to use a 1.44mb drive on the 5150 for data transfer.
 
The problem I have is that the M4 disk images I have are in the emulator format. Unless image disk can convert them? They have a .DSK extension. And the Cheapo driver is written under LS-DOS 6.3.x & LDOS 5.3.x
 
Maybe someone could write a program specifically to write trs80 format floppies on a 5150? What is special about the format; is an IBM PC drive attached to the standard IBM controller physically able to write it?
 
I think it can write and Al has been able to with limited success on his 5150. The standard disk controllers in most semi modern computers can write Model III or 4 floppies assuming they are running DOS or Win 9x and an emulator. Model 1's are where you might run into trouble being mostly single density. Also he is using Imagedisk which I have never had any success with. My computers choke on it! So that's why I use an emulator to make my disks. So the program is out there just need a computer that can handle the requirements of the emulator being used. Just my 2 cents worth
 
Ok, got it working!

I used Tim Mann's SDL-TRS for Windows and used that to create a blank .DMK and copied LS-DOS to it, and it converted and wrote fine. So, now I'm making a double-sided LS-DOS Master and I'll make a copy of that and add the driver files.

Doing the same now for L-DOS 5.3.1

I'll make clean copies of both driver disks in .IMD format later today and upload them.

I learned a lot about all this stuff.
 
pearce_jj said:
Maybe someone could write a program specifically to write trs80 format floppies on a 5150? What is special about the format; is an IBM PC drive attached to the standard IBM controller physically able to write it?
Click to expand...

Imagedisk works fine if you have a disk controller that supports Single Density format. The Sergey's FDC board I built does.

The problem has been TRSTOOLS writing bad .DMK images which work fine with TRS32, but choke DMK2IMD and Imagedisk.

SDL-TRS writes nice DMK images that work fine with DMK2IMD.
 
The computer is not seeing my SDcard. I'm taking a short break right now. I'll try again in a little bit. It may be this SDcard adapter doesn't take power from pin 20, and I have to add a jumper wire, or a power connector.
 
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