Disk boot failure

[Ol Rattler]

Greetings, CPU Type: Am486 DX4. System will not boot up. In the past, system worked perfectly. Then last year I started getting a Hard disk fail error display, Press F1 to continue. The startup sequence would then finish, all is well. As of a couple of months ago, The system deteriorated further by displaying"Disk Boot Failure", Insert System Disk and press enter. My first question is, what does System Disk mean? I have an OS/2 Instal Cd-ROM. Is that it? Secondly, Please see attachments to view pics of Failure sequence.

Thanks for your time and consideration,

O.R.

 

[daver2]

It is trying to boot from the system disk (e.g. the hard disk). If the BIOS detects that the hard disk does not contain a bootable system (e.g. it has become corrupt in a certain way) it is asking you to put a disk in that is bootable.

This may be a floppy disk or a CD-ROM.

However, the main install disk will want to copy the install CD-ROM to a hard disk - that sounds like it is now faulty...

It could also be the BIOS battery that has failed, and the configuration information has evaporated.

Dave

 

[Ol Rattler]

It is trying to boot from the system disk (e.g. the hard disk). If the BIOS detects that the hard disk does not contain a bootable system (e.g. it has become corrupt in a certain way) it is asking you to put a disk in that is bootable.

This may be a floppy disk or a CD-ROM.

However, the main install disk will want to copy the install CD-ROM to a hard disk - that sounds like it is now faulty...

It could also be the BIOS battery that has failed, and the configuration information has evaporated.

Dave

 

[Ol Rattler]

Hard Disk. Is that the heavy silver colored box that's screwed into a slot? The computer repair tech, that I go to occasionally, has little to no experience in dealing with vintage computers. He tells me that he was able to determine that the hard drive was functioning properly. So, there are no floppies or Cd-ROM installed. On a side note, I have a brand new/old OS/2 version 3 WARP package. As far as the battery is concerned, when all of these error's were on display, I replaced the wafer type battery with a new 2316, I think it was a 2316. The system worked for a short time, then the system failed all together. My friend also suggested that when I had replaced the battery, my BIOS settings were lost for the hard drive and floppy setups along with the memory/cache timings. I have no idea what any of that means. In the attachment is a pic of my hard drive.

OR

 

[daver2]

Yes, that is the hard drive.

The battery holds the configurable parameters for the BIOS. If the battery fails (or you replace it) you can loose the BIOS configuration, and have to reset it again by hand through the BIOS.

It is usual to write down the configuration settings in the paperwork for the machine for this very reason.

Some hard disk BIOS configuration can be determined automatically. Others have to have the parameters manually entered.

If the latter, you will not be able to get the machine working again until these are entered.

You need to find someone else in your area to help out...

Dave

 

[Ol Rattler]

Yes, that is the hard drive.

The battery holds the configurable parameters for the BIOS. If the battery fails (or you replace it) you can loose the BIOS configuration, and have to reset it again by hand through the BIOS.

It is usual to write down the configuration settings in the paperwork for the machine for this very reason.

Some hard disk BIOS configuration can be determined automatically. Others have to have the parameters manually entered.

If the latter, you will not be able to get the machine working again until these are entered.

You need to find someone else in your area to help out...

Dave

 

[Ol Rattler]

Thank you, sir

 

[seaken]

Hello OR, welcome to the forum.

Can you take some more pictures of your system and share them here? Front and back and inside.

Most systems from that era would have a floppy drive installed and probably did not support "booting" from a CD-ROM. If you do not have a floppy drive installed this could require some help from a person who could supply a working floppy, even if only temporarily.

But, you may be able to reset the hard drive parameters yourself and get the hard drive to boot. One one of those screen you shared we see that hitting the DEL (Delete) key at boot up will get us in to the BIOS setup. Once in the BIOS setup look for the setting for the hard drive and make sure you type in the parameters just as you see them on the label on the hard drive. Your helper should be able to get you this far. If resetting the correct drive parameters works the system should again boot from the hard drive. If that doesn't work you will want a floppy drive and a properly formatted boot floppy diskette with your Operating System files. Are you running OS/2?

Sometimes a hard drive can be prepared on another system and then swapped back in to your regular computer. But you will need another compatible system for that to work. Maybe you helper has one?

Anyway, share some pics and start looking for a compatible floppy drive and some floppy diskettes formatted with your operating system.

Seaken

 

[Ol Rattler]

Hello OR, welcome to the forum.

Can you take some more pictures of your system and share them here? Front and back and inside.

Most systems from that era would have a floppy drive installed and probably did not support "booting" from a CD-ROM. If you do not have a floppy drive installed this could require some help from a person who could supply a working floppy, even if only temporarily.

But, you may be able to reset the hard drive parameters yourself and get the hard drive to boot. One one of those screen you shared we see that hitting the DEL (Delete) key at boot up will get us in to the BIOS setup. Once in the BIOS setup look for the setting for the hard drive and make sure you type in the parameters just as you see them on the label on the hard drive. Your helper should be able to get you this far. If resetting the correct drive parameters works the system should again boot from the hard drive. If that doesn't work you will want a floppy drive and a properly formatted boot floppy diskette with your Operating System files. Are you running OS/2?

Sometimes a hard drive can be prepared on another system and then swapped back in to your regular computer. But you will need another compatible system for that to work. Maybe you helper has one?

Anyway, share some pics and start looking for a compatible floppy drive and some floppy diskettes formatted with your operating system.

Seaken

 

[Ol Rattler]

Thank you, Seaken. I'm happy to be here.
Yes, It's an IBM C.C.I. Am486DX4 with DOS OS/2 Warp ver.3 It does have a 3.5 floppy drive in place as well as a Cd-rom. Please see attachment for hard drive specs. Please let me know if you still need outside pictures.

O.R.

 

[seaken]

Hi O.R. I don't know what and IBM C.C.I. is. But it's good that you do have a floppy drive. So, apparently you don't have a bootable OS/2 Warp 3 diskette? Can you get into the BIOS with the DEL key?

Yes, pictures of your computer will help.

Seaken

 

[seaken]

It's been a while since I worked with OS/2 Warp 3. But I think if it were me I would use a MS-DOS boot diskette and setup the CD-ROM drivers for my CD-ROM. Then I would put in the Warp 3 CD and start the setup. I think there is a utility to make a boot disk on that CD. But my memory may not be correct. I have some notes somewhere. I will try to find them.

Seaken

 

[Ol Rattler]

It's been a while since I worked with OS/2 Warp 3. But I think if it were me I would use a MS-DOS boot diskette and setup the CD-ROM drivers for my CD-ROM. Then I would put in the Warp 3 CD and start the setup. I think there is a utility to make a boot disk on that CD. But my memory may not be correct. I have some notes somewhere. I will try to find them.

Seaken

I may have to send two replies in order to accomodate all of the pictures. I even have all the goodies info for the OS/2 package. Please see pics, my friend. Yes, I have all kinds of goodies for OS/2 and yes, to DEL.

 

[daver2]

So, from the photographs you have a CD-ROM drive fitted, a hard disk and what looks to be two off 3 1/2" floppy disk drives. The floppy disk drives (assuming both of them are wired) should be the A: and B: drives. The hard disk will probably be the C: drive and the CD-ROM could be a D: drive.

Boot up error #4 (in post #1) clearly shows a drive A: and C: but no B: or CD-ROM. Depending upon the age of the machine, the CD-ROM may not appear in the BIOS display of course...

It could be that the B: floppy drive is not connected, or the BIOS is not configured to see it.

Can you see whether a power and signal cable are connected to both of the floppy disk drives or just one?

Dave

 

[Ol Rattler]

So, from the photographs you have a CD-ROM drive fitted, a hard disk and what looks to be two off 3 1/2" floppy disk drives. The floppy disk drives (assuming both of them are wired) should be the A: and B: drives. The hard disk will probably be the C: drive and the CD-ROM could be a D: drive.

Boot up error #4 (in post #1) clearly shows a drive A: and C: but no B: or CD-ROM. Depending upon the age of the machine, the CD-ROM may not appear in the BIOS display of course...

It could be that the B: floppy drive is not connected, or the BIOS is not configured to see it.

Can you see whether a power and signal cable are connected to both of the floppy disk drives or just one?

Dave

There's only floppy A: No B:. Hard drive definitely C: drive. CD-ROM, unknown. Also, I can't remember if the hard drive had a ribbon connected. Bottom of cage. Here's a start up error pic. This pic was the first error to display and by simply pressing F1, the system would boot up the rest of the way and operate with no problems. Approx. 6 months later, I would have to restart several times along with F1 and then finally, Disc boot failure. Complete failure was gradual. Changed battery with no status change.

 

[daver2]

>>> There's only floppy A: No B:.

I can see two (2) physical 3.5" floppy disk drives fitted into the chassis...



Are you saying that one of these drives is not physically connected or are you going from the BIOS display?

The two are subtly different.

The photograph of the cables does NOT show the detail I require to know...

The boot up screen is not of interest at this stage of the game.

Dave

 

[seaken]

and yes, to DEL.

Are you saying you are able to get into the BIOS with the DEL key? If so, please post pictures of the BIOS screens, especially the screen that shows the disk drives. Also, it's hard to tell if the cables are connected correctly to the drives. Need pictures that show the cable connections to the drives and at the motherboard.

Seaken

 

[Brian Todd]

Maybe an incredibly stupid question, but did you disconnect the ISA cable from the hard drive yourself after you got the boot failures? Your pic "IBM right side 2" shows the power connected to your hard drive but not the ribbon cable. You will certainly never get your system to boot without reattaching the ribbon cable so do that first ... it is the black block just behind your hard drive and can only be inserted in one way .. you may have to wiggle it a couple of times until it seats properly over the pins of the hard drive .. just do it with feeling and do not force it.

Assuming you removed the ribbon yourself after you got the boot failures, and that reattaching it does not help .... on your pic "Boot up Error #4" the screen shows Drive C as being "User Type, 516MB", and picture #3 shows a hard drive failure. This suggests that your system sees the hard drive but cannot read from it. It could therefore be that you lost the correct disk settings in the BIOS when you changed the battery. If you press "del" when you start up the system, you will get into the bios. Set the hard disk to "Auto" and save the bios. See if that helps!

 

[Ol Rattler]

>>> There's only floppy A: No B:.

I can see two (2) physical 3.5" floppy disk drives fitted into the chassis...

View attachment 1271841

Are you saying that one of these drives is not physically connected or are you going from the BIOS display?

The two are subtly different.

The photograph of the cables does NOT show the detail I require to know...

The boot up screen is not of interest at this stage of the game.

Dave

Maybe an incredibly stupid question, but did you disconnect the ISA cable from the hard drive yourself after you got the boot failures? Your pic "IBM right side 2" shows the power connected to your hard drive but not the ribbon cable. You will certainly never get your system to boot without reattaching the ribbon cable so do that first ... it is the black block just behind your hard drive and can only be inserted in one way .. you may have to wiggle it a couple of times until it seats properly over the pins of the hard drive .. just do it with feeling and do not force it.

Assuming you removed the ribbon yourself after you got the boot failures, and that reattaching it does not help .... on your pic "Boot up Error #4" the screen shows Drive C as being "User Type, 516MB", and picture #3 shows a hard drive failure. This suggests that your system sees the hard drive but cannot read from it. It could therefore be that you lost the correct disk settings in the BIOS when you changed the battery. If you press "del" when you start up the system, you will get into the bios. Set the hard disk to "Auto" and save the bios. See if that helps!

Hello Brian, The thing stupid about a question is that it wasn't asked. In my view.
Honestly, I don't remember disconnecting a ribbon at all. I was wondering about that. I should've taken a few pics, prior. That may qualify as stupid. There is a black block connector that is pre-bent that looks like it's aligned with hard drive. What would happen if I'm wrong?

 

[daver2]

There is no signal cable plugged into the hard drive, so at can't possibly work...

Dave