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Maxtor XT-2190 MFM Help

eswan said:
Arrrgh... I _always_ get those backwards.


I wonder if it actually uses that for anything. Those screenshots trigger memories of setting up (BSD?) disklabels once upon a time, and If I remember correctly, they're more for documenting the configuration. Same with the "Maker....Maxtor " field. I'd try 1024, 8, 17 first. That would prove the drive is working. If that worked try 1024, 9, 17. That would show controller/software support for heads > 8.
1024x8x17/2 = 69632 Kbytes, 70 MByte. (divide by 2 because 512 bytes per sector is 1/2 Kbyte)

I think I've still got an Altos 2086 kicking around, not sure what size drive. I'll take a look at how it's configured.
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Oh man a 2086!!! I had one!!! The one my dad threw out and I was so upset with him!!! Those use a 190mb!!! I’d so give you an offer for that machine!!!! Seriously!!
 
eswan said:
Arrrgh... I _always_ get those backwards.


I wonder if it actually uses that for anything. Those screenshots trigger memories of setting up (BSD?) disklabels once upon a time, and If I remember correctly, they're more for documenting the configuration. Same with the "Maker....Maxtor " field. I'd try 1024, 8, 17 first. That would prove the drive is working. If that worked try 1024, 9, 17. That would show controller/software support for heads > 8.
1024x8x17/2 = 69632 Kbytes, 70 MByte. (divide by 2 because 512 bytes per sector is 1/2 Kbyte)

I think I've still got an Altos 2086 kicking around, not sure what size drive. I'll take a look at how it's configured.
Click to expand...
So if I’m flagging the bad sectors the ones on head 12 don’t recognize of course.. I’m still trying to figure out what to specify for size.. I think the Xenix install wants it for some reason.. because when I put in another size it got angry and said can’t install on a 150mb system… for example
 
Ok so here is my first go.. see photo.. I’ll try to install now..
 

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aplmak said:
So when I give these a shot what drive should I set it at?
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Good question. Formatted size in MB (assuming 1024 and not 1000 divisor)
cylinders * heads * sectors * 512 / 1024 / 1024

For one example
1024*15*16*512/1024/1024 = 120 MB.

If it won't take that then someone with more Xenix knowledge is needed.
1224*15*17*512/1024/1024 = 152.4 MB. The 190 MB you have been using is strange since it would seem odd that it wants unformatted drive size. Could that be part of your problem. Its trying to write 190 MB to a 152.4 MB drive? Can you find a manual for the format utility that explains more?

Altos explains more. Its not standard PC.

Did find an Altos 586 image from an emulator user. Its 16 sectors per track so likely that's what they used.
--format Altos_586 --sectors 16,0 --heads 8 --cylinders 512 --header_crc 0xffff,0x1021,16,0 --data_crc 0xe60c,0x1021,16,0 --sector_length 512
 
djg said:
Good question. Formatted size in MB (assuming 1024 and not 1000 divisor)
cylinders * heads * sectors * 512 / 1024 / 1024

For one example
1024*15*16*512/1024/1024 = 120 MB.

If it won't take that then someone with more Xenix knowledge is needed.
1224*15*17*512/1024/1024 = 152.4 MB. The 190 MB you have been using is strange since it would seem odd that it wants unformatted drive size. Could that be part of your problem. Its trying to write 190 MB to a 152.4 MB drive? Can you find a manual for the format utility that explains more?

Altos explains more. Its not standard PC.

Did find an Altos 586 image from an emulator user. Its 16 sectors per track so likely that's what they used.
--format Altos_586 --sectors 16,0 --heads 8 --cylinders 512 --header_crc 0xffff,0x1021,16,0 --data_crc 0xe60c,0x1021,16,0 --sector_length 512
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Oh I totally understand what you mean by the unformatted/formatted size thing. I am not certain what they mean either. You know in order to get even into the backdoor to reconfigure a hard drive it’s password protected. It was so only service techs could do it. So there isn’t much documented out there for that.

I looked at the 886 manual. They talk about flagging bad sectors but nothing about formatting.. it’s secret stuff lol!!!
 
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djg said:
Good question. Formatted size in MB (assuming 1024 and not 1000 divisor)
cylinders * heads * sectors * 512 / 1024 / 1024

For one example
1024*15*16*512/1024/1024 = 120 MB.

If it won't take that then someone with more Xenix knowledge is needed.
1224*15*17*512/1024/1024 = 152.4 MB. The 190 MB you have been using is strange since it would seem odd that it wants unformatted drive size. Could that be part of your problem. Its trying to write 190 MB to a 152.4 MB drive? Can you find a manual for the format utility that explains more?

Altos explains more. Its not standard PC.

Did find an Altos 586 image from an emulator user. Its 16 sectors per track so likely that's what they used.
--format Altos_586 --sectors 16,0 --heads 8 --cylinders 512 --header_crc 0xffff,0x1021,16,0 --data_crc 0xe60c,0x1021,16,0 --sector_length 512
Click to expand...
The 586’s hard drive limit was 40mb I think. You might be able to get away with 80
 
Well this is what I got when using 1224,8,16,512 and labeled 190mb
 

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If I use the settings above this post I think I only get like 70mb total.. I have a Micropolis 80mb and a 80mb image that works fine. I'm just trying to get a larger drive for this baby.

I gave up... if I try the recommended settings according to the spec sheet for the XT-2190, 1224 cyl,15 heads,16 sectors,512 sector size and 190mb I get errors (see photo)

What makes no sense is an Altos 686 I have that came with an XT-2190 already formatted and installed and works and shows almost 190mb even though it is supposed to be 150mb formatted... (scratching my head).. a 686 btw is the same as an 886 just has fewer serial ports, everything else is the same.
 

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Have you tried this drive on any other system? I'm wondering if maybe it has a bad head.

On one of the screenshots it shows "Installing a 190 megabyte system". Maybe the installer is setup to do a different type of install depending on the available space? A '190 megabyte system' being a full install, while if you only had a 100MB drive it would install an '80 megabyte system', leaving out optional pieces or partitioned differently? From the brochure -- http://vtda.org/docs/computing/Altos/Marketing/Altos_886_Brochure.pdf it looks like they classed the 886 as 886-25, 886T-50, 886T-80, so maybe they had scripted installs depending on the drive size.
 
Eswan I know exactly what your saying. The thing is if I use a working image of the drive with the MFM emulator and try to reinstall from scratch on that image I get the same errors. So it’s not the drive for sure. If I perform a Xenix upgrade option it’s fine. According to all documentation the 80MB is the highest advertised. But I have the 190 (or whatever size..) it reports right around 190MB works fine. I’ve tried 150, 160 and it doesn’t like those numbers.. I might just connect the MFM emulator with David G at VCF East and get his input. The emulator will show you what the drive is trying to do real time.. I’ve just never really used that feature.
 
Hmmmm just found on a spec sheet…. 80MB unformatted 63MB formatted or 50MB unformatted 40MB formatted.. maybe I can try again and use 160 or 126… I’ll give that a whirl.. who knows..
 
Hey question gang.. I am horrible at math and calculating the sectors, and cylinders, etc. So I formatted as a Priam V185 drive that I once had and I have the specs. Sure enough works perfectly like a charm. Its around 80mb and it represents the correct blocks and fsck's fine. But since this is a 190mb Maxtor is there any way I could bump up the cylinders and maybe heads to squeeze out what I can. I do believe the limiting factor here is the max heads. So the specs for a Priam V185 are: Max Cyl - 1166, Max Head - 7, Max Sectors - 16, Sector Size - 512, Trak Skew - 1, Sector Interleave - 0, and the make is listed as a Priam and size is set as 80mb.

So I am not sure if there is a ceiling of 80mb on this machine or if it has something to do with the max heads. The Maxtor is around I think 15 heads as I mentioned before and it does not like that... So if I were to bump it up to 8 heads, and bump up the sectors and max cyl. what size can someone recommend I try? And I would need to know each of those values to give it a try. And what the amount of space I would be able to try out (I realize that the setting for size probably doesn't really do anything and the model type). Any help would be really appreciated...

I have a hard drive bible V8, I might take a peek through that and see if I can see a drive where I could bump it up and get the max amount of space possible.
 
aplmak said:
Hey question gang.. I am horrible at math and calculating the sectors, and cylinders, etc. So I formatted as a Priam V185 drive that I once had and I have the specs. Sure enough works perfectly like a charm. Its around 80mb and it represents the correct blocks and fsck's fine. But since this is a 190mb Maxtor is there any way I could bump up the cylinders and maybe heads to squeeze out what I can. I do believe the limiting factor here is the max heads. So the specs for a Priam V185 are: Max Cyl - 1166, Max Head - 7, Max Sectors - 16, Sector Size - 512, Trak Skew - 1, Sector Interleave - 0, and the make is listed as a Priam and size is set as 80mb.

So I am not sure if there is a ceiling of 80mb on this machine or if it has something to do with the max heads. The Maxtor is around I think 15 heads as I mentioned before and it does not like that... So if I were to bump it up to 8 heads, and bump up the sectors and max cyl. what size can someone recommend I try? And I would need to know each of those values to give it a try. And what the amount of space I would be able to try out (I realize that the setting for size probably doesn't really do anything and the model type). Any help would be really appreciated...

I have a hard drive bible V8, I might take a peek through that and see if I can see a drive where I could bump it up and get the max amount of space possible.
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Looking in the Hard Drive Bible V8 it appears almost that the Maxtor X190 is about one of the only highest sizes you can go. Most MFM drives are around maybe 80mb or less for the most part. I'm just tinkering here... I'd be curious if I could just squeeze a little more room out of this drive with different suggestions on specs... :)
 
There were several 1224 cylinder MFM drives. One that comes to mind is the Priam/Atasi 519, as well as other members of the Maxtor 21xx series and Rodime had a couple of them.

I know I have a Priam drive as well as a Maxtor sitting on a shelf in my junkpile. I doubt that either of them works anymore. I used both with RLL controllers and 26 sectors/track.
 
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