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yet another PDP-11 barebone hack

sam2000

Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2023
Messages
24
Location
Milan - Italy
Hello, inspired by other members I'm opening this new thread hoping one day to have my own self-made PDP-11.
There are many reasons that brought me to creating a PDP11 but I would be honest in saying it's for fun, for the sake of it, for giving a tribute to the PDP11, and last but not least to learn something new, to face a new challenge, to improve myself.
It's still very much a work in progress, but I can begin to lay down what I am aiming. I am open to suggestions.

Once completed the system should be able to run BSD2.11 and look "like" a 11/70 using a PiDP11 console.
I'll favor through hole components, but if neede I'll go also the SMD way. I think I'll use a modified ECB N8VEM backplane, easily available with 16bit databus and 24bit address bus. I heard the 96 pin connectors are quite costly though. For what is possible I don't want to emulate QBUS or UniBUS. Right now I have in mind a system with 4 cards.

CPU card: CPU is going to be a DCJ11, it's quite compact, powerful, easy to find, and most important I already have one.
I am unsure about the FPU, the FPJ11 21-21858 is quite rare, quite expensive, and I couldn't find its datasheet, pinout and information about connecting it to the CPU.
The memory will be 4MB of static RAM, zero wait state. I guess 50-60ns will be enough?
A CPU governor, clock generator, TOY RTC, console serial port and the necessary glue logic.

I/O card: 4 serial ports DLV11-style, and possibly some parallel ports

HD card: emulated HD to either an SD card or an IDE port

Network card: 10BASE5 AUI port

Well now for the things I still need to figure out...
I still need to figure out the correct memory map, for the serial devices and not only. Interrupt mangaement in regarding to I/O. Also the ROM is an important factor, the system should be able to boot from the HD.
I/O will have to be as close as possible compatible with DEC devices, I don't plan and don't want to get entangled with writing kernel device drivers. Out of the various PDP/HACKs available I found very interesting the minimal proof of concept of Brent Hilpert, so instead of the DC319 I think I'll use the 6402. HD emulator, other PDP hacks succeded, so it is feasible, I'll have to study on it. The network approach is more complicated, I couldn't find a working hack yet, but it's very desirable: I don't want to do networking with a 9600 baud slip.
Lastly, some logic will be needed to interface the bus to the multiplexed lights and keys of the PiDP11 console. Also, it looks to me the PiDP11 case is quite shallow, some carpenter's hack will be needed there too :)

that's it for the moment, thanks for your patience

Paolo
 
In order to use the PiDP11 panel on your real PDP11, you will have to have the PDP11 running a program in order to drive the panel. Unless you plan to interface the panel directly to the raw bus?

Dave
 
In order to use the PiDP11 panel on your real PDP11, you will have to have the PDP11 running a program in order to drive the panel. Unless you plan to interface the panel directly to the raw bus?

Dave
I would love to find manuals about how the original 11/70 panel was working. I believe there was no software to drive it instead it was all hardware driven. The PiDP console instead use a matrix scan system so I suppose I'll end up with a dedicated mcu interfacing the dcj bus
 
On the 11/45 it is all in the microcode for the CPU.

Dave
Thanks so basically it was a software debugger... I need to read about the 11/70 too. Even if it's something that can be achieved with microcode or dedicated software, I'll still need some external hardware to multiplex and demultiplex the signals
 
Hello Paolo,

for some switch panel inspiration take a look here:


I hope you will be able to get all up and running how you want it!
If you are interested in an FPJ11 we can discuss that via PM.

Best regards
Thanks, interesting material. As for the fpu, first of all I need to understand the benefits of having one (I think the DCJ is supporting emulated instructions) and the hardware feasibility (i.e. as of today I don't have datasheets and documentations on how to wire it to the cpu). If I manage, I could provide an empty socket for the fpu and some jumpers to enable it or not, and think about getting one when I have the money, surely you know it's not a few cents.
 
Even the lowly 11/05 implements the console switch functions in microcode.
Right, actually even the DCJ has microcode for the console, but being a more advanced cpu it uses a serial console, so very likely for a switch console I'll have to write some code... or maybe dump the debugger from a /70 system and use that? 🤷‍♂️
 
I think you are confusing the microcode on the /70 for the PDP-11 instruction set in the CPU. The two are NOT the same.

The microcode is more akin to a 'hardware control language'. It is not PDP-11 instructions in ROM.

Unless you are talking about the ODT software debugger?

Dave
 
I think you are confusing the microcode on the /70 for the PDP-11 instruction set in the CPU. The two are NOT the same.

The microcode is more akin to a 'hardware control language'. It is not PDP-11 instructions in ROM.

Unless you are talking about the ODT software debugger?

Dave
Indeed microcode and ISA is not the same, and yes the dcj cpu uses the ODT console. I guess I will face the issue step by step as I progress
 
Thanks, interesting material. As for the fpu, first of all I need to understand the benefits of having one (I think the DCJ is supporting emulated instructions) and the hardware feasibility (i.e. as of today I don't have datasheets and documentations on how to wire it to the cpu). If I manage, I could provide an empty socket for the fpu and some jumpers to enable it or not, and think about getting one when I have the money, surely you know it's not a few cents.


What you need is here:


and



Have fun!
 
I heard the 96 pin connectors are quite costly though
I don't think so.

HARTING connectors, not an unkown chinese manufacturer:

€ 1.67 VAT included
€1.96 VAT included

It's time to buy :)
 
…you’re going to build a Qbus machine with Qbus cards on a non-Qbus backplane? How is that gonna work?
 
Beware about the level 2 and level 3. This indicates the number of insertions and removals the connectors are good for (i.e. the amount of gold on the pins).

If one connector is level 3 - that is the weakest link in the chain (50 matings).

It probably doesn't matter - but (just in case it does)...

Been there with our remanufactured equipment for work. I had to get some level 1 connectors made especially.

Dave
 
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