Composite capture recommendations

[tony359]

Hi all,

I'm looking for a recommendation for a good COMPOSITE capture device. I have an OSSC which works well with VGA and Component. I also have one of those "cheap" AVTOHDMI boxes but it seldom works, picture jumps all over the place.
Then I bought an "add-on" board from Aliexpress for the OSSC - Composite to Component/SCART.

It worked for a while, then it failed. Or maybe it never worked, I'm not even sure. I got 50% back and a paperweight. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005764305327.html?spm=a2g0s.12269583.0.0.62fa9d53DIIY4z

I'd be wary of spending more money on things which don't work. I really need something that works with those non-standard video signals such as the Apple II or the ZX Spectrum or the Commodore 64. I see the OSSC is paired with the Koryuu converter, which is not cheap. Let's say that I'm not prepared to spend $300 on a Retrotink 5x but maybe it's time I invest on something that is supposed to work.

Any suggestions?

 

[NeXT]

I use one of those super cheap USB capture dongles. The only two issues I've run into with them was the colors tend to shift and it wants a somewhat disciplined video signal. If the sync or signal strength is unstable it may drop the input.

 

[tony359]

I've now purchased three different devices. Elgato, cheap Ebay one, OSSC "add-on". They all failed or don't work well with "undisciplined" signals such as the A2 or the ZX Spectrum. I'd rather spend a bit more and not waste my time trying to make them work but I'm unable to find something that is supposed to work reliably. The Retrotink Discord group is telling me not even the Retrotink might work as it would still pass the signal to the capture device so it's up to it to process it.

 

[NeXT]

What if you put a time-base corrector in between? Something that stabilizes the video signal?

 

[Plasma]

I recommend a quality video scaler such as the Extron DSC 301HD (HDMI output) or Extron DVS 304 (VGA output). They go for around $50-$70 on ebay. Then any standard VGA or HDMI capture card should do the rest of the job.

 

[tony359]

Plasma, that looks cool. Do you have experience with those and retro machines? There is indeed one available in my area.

I've also found this: https://nicole.express/2021/composite-conflict-completed.html - and Apple II+ is featured and the Extron (different model) seems to be working fine with it. It's curious that the MINIAV2HD (I have one of those) is just not working and jumping all over the place. But I suspect there might be a million types around.

 

[Plasma]

Unfortunately I don't have any of the systems in your original post, so I can't guarantee anything. But here is a post about using the DVS 304 with a C64.

 

[Pickelhaube808]

I can't confirm that it would work in your situation since I don't have those machines, but I have a Dazzle DVD Recorder HD that I got open box for $25 and it's the best usb composite + svideo capture device I have used. The drivers were a bit of a pain to get set up (took like half an hour of digging through forums), but it has been smooth sailing since for all of the devices I have tried.

 

[tony359]

Plasma,

A web interface with all the settings! Looks very appealing. Also Component output? It would me amazing so I can keep my OSSC's VGA port free for my retro PCs!

Someone mentions those Extron's having the same ICs found in CRTs, hence the good quality. Well, for the price I guess I can give it a go. There also is a DSC 301HD available at half the price but my HDMI capture device is a USB HDMI dongle - it's proven VERY good but I have no control on what it can and cannot do. I'd hope that with the Extron and the OSSC in the pipeline I should be able to make the signal work. Though someone would say "less is better"

If I get the Extron I'll make a video review so others can also evaluate! Thanks for now!

 

[tony359]

Well the Extron seems not to be working with my sources or maybe it's defective?

I see the same "jumping" issue (somethings it's stable but "split in half") on everything Composite/SVideo I am throwing at it. C64, ZX Spectrum, Apple //e.

The C64 was supposed to work with it - but looking better online that was an NTSC unit. Would that make a difference? VGA input is a bit better but still vastly inferior than what my Dell monitor can display when plugged directly.

Opinions?

 

[Plasma]

Have you tried disabling film mode? Looks like maybe it's trying to reverse interlaced pulldown that doesn't exist.

 

[tony359]

Yes. I have updated to 2.14 twice, reset the unit with the button at the back (that's more than holding "1", it also reverts to factory 1.10 FW), tinkered with all the settings I could see. Those pictures are from my monitor as I wasn't sure if it was the OSSC introducing the issue or not so I went straight to the monitor to rule the capture out.
The very same monitor doesn't have issues displaying those very signals.

VGA in to VGA out works BUT if scaled, the outcome is poor. Again my DELL monitor does a MUCH BETTER job when wired directly to the VGA source. When I disable the scaling on the Extron, then VGA signal is fine. Also test patterns from the Extron look nice and sharp all the time.

It really feels as there might be an issue with the analogue input stage of that 304?

 

[Plasma]

It really feels as there might be an issue with the analogue input stage of that 304?

Maybe? Troubleshooting at that level is out of my depth, beyond the obvious like bad caps.

You could contact Extron and see what they say. I bought a second-hand scan converter years ago and emailed them about an issue. I was surprised to get a reply from an actual engineer.

 

[jafir]

They have amazing support. I have a test pattern generator from them. It’s ancient and will do TTL video. Anyway, the floppy disk with the software wouldn’t read at all so I emailed them and they were super helpful and sent me a zip file with the windows 3.1 era software and even made sure I knew it probably wouldn’t work with 64bit windows. I told them that running it on windows 3.1 or 95 wouldn’t be a problem for me.

 

[tony359]

I guess it won't hurt. I've emailed them.

But I have already an Ebay return open if they can't help.

 

[tony359]

I've got a Startech composite to HDMI converter, it's doing a good job. The Apple can be a bit temperamental - though I suspect it's expected - and unfortunately it doesn't like the ZX Spectrum signal (DELL monitor as a comparison attached).

The DELL is doing a slightly better job on almost everything.

This is not cheap though, paid £90 on Amazon Warehouse, it would be £125 otherwise.

 

[tony359]

The Startech works perfectly fine on an Apple II Europlus and on a Dragon 64. I was surprised by the Apple tbh as I think that has the worst of the signals ever being an NTSC machine running at 50Hz or something like that.
I'm going to try a different composite mod on the Spectrum. Then I can also test my Apple //c.

Finally, someone is lending me their Startech USB converter, in case it's better. I think it might give more options to tweak the signal. But for now, the StarTech seems to be a capable one.