Managing your retro projects...tips?

[syzygy]

I usually don’t indulge in starting these purely discussion threads but I am doing so now. How do you deal with your “projects” with regard to all things retro as far as appropriate subject matter for the forum?

I don’t mean work that you are paid for (or hope to be paid for) where there are deadlines. I mean the projects you are working on now…and, especially ones that you started…way back when…and have yet to finish. Do you declare projects abandoned?

How do you handle prioritizing?

Do you try to multi-task projects or do one at a time until it is finished?

Do you have a bazillion projects going on all the time?

Does that “fun” project ever become a burdensome “I should finish that” or does it not bother you at all or something in the middle?

Do you lose interest in that “fun” project and go start another “funner” project?

Do you have any tips for such issues?

I am curious how other folks manage the "hobby".

 

[DougM]

Well, there's 2 ends to the spectrum here: the "follow your folly" camp (I'm in that one) and the "focus until it's complete" camp (I'm definitely not in that one).

I tend to simply rotate/overlap my projects. I admit right up front that there's a significant re-acquaintance phase with this approach but I find it much more enjoyable and I think my brain just needs a break to sort things out. So I have, at this moment, maybe 12 to 15 projects that are somewhere in process or early planning, and I actively rotate maybe 3 or 4 of them in and out.

As to abandoning projects sometimes it's obvious that a project is doomed. Usually when every step of the project is so painful that you actively don't want to work on it that's when I walk away. But other projects just evolve into a mess and I usually let those go. Or I flat out lose interest. Letting a project sit for a while really does crystallize how interested I am in working on it.

But some projects are so cool that I just keep coming back to them despite the pain. My paper tape punch project is that way.

The other thing I've found is that advances in one project often open doors in other projects. I have a touch screen project going (my first) that has suddenly opened the door to much better UI's than were possible before (rotary encoder knobs and buttons) so I'm beginning to retrofit to some of my other projects. Which requires a lot of re-work.

Another thing is that once I have a project up and running I usually find ways to improve it, or fix some of my initial bad ideas. Again pushing the timeline out.

Lastly sometimes what I have in stock will drive what I work on or even enable a new project. For instance I recently came into possession of a very large number of very small servos for free, which suddenly enabled a project I had been thinking about for a long time but was cost prohibitive based on the cost of acquiring so many servos. Although unfortunately as I started into it I realized that many small servos might not be the best approach. At which point I took a break from it to let my brain sort it out

So I don't have any advice, except maybe do what your brain is tuned for.

 

[VERAULT]

Im usually juggling two to 5 projects at a time. I use the time between ordering parts to move to the next project or just give something a couple days then move to the next. It definitely helps with burnout. The downside is i have systems and parts for up to 5 machines laid out which can be a huge clutter and lead to its own chaos.

I keep lists on my computer of most of what i have for components so thst really helps in not having to buy things multiple times by accident.

 

[syzygy]

Well, there's 2 ends to the spectrum here: the "follow your folly" camp (I'm in that one) and the "focus until it's complete" camp (I'm definitely not in that one).

I tend to simply rotate/overlap my projects. I admit right up front that there's a significant re-acquaintance phase with this approach but I find it much more enjoyable and I think my brain just needs a break to sort things out. So I have, at this moment, maybe 12 to 15 projects that are somewhere in process or early planning, and I actively rotate maybe 3 or 4 of them in and out.

As to abandoning projects sometimes it's obvious that a project is doomed. Usually when every step of the project is so painful that you actively don't want to work on it that's when I walk away. But other projects just evolve into a mess and I usually let those go. Or I flat out lose interest. Letting a project sit for a while really does crystallize how interested I am in working on it.

But some projects are so cool that I just keep coming back to them despite the pain. My paper tape punch project is that way.

The other thing I've found is that advances in one project often open doors in other projects. I have a touch screen project going (my first) that has suddenly opened the door to much better UI's than were possible before (rotary encoder knobs and buttons) so I'm beginning to retrofit to some of my other projects. Which requires a lot of re-work.

Another thing is that once I have a project up and running I usually find ways to improve it, or fix some of my initial bad ideas. Again pushing the timeline out.

Lastly sometimes what I have in stock will drive what I work on or even enable a new project. For instance I recently came into possession of a very large number of very small servos for free, which suddenly enabled a project I had been thinking about for a long time but was cost prohibitive based on the cost of acquiring so many servos. Although unfortunately as I started into it I realized that many small servos might not be the best approach. At which point I took a break from it to let my brain sort it out

So I don't have any advice, except maybe do what your brain is tuned for.

There is a lot to what you have written and I read it and will read it again.

"focus until it's complete" That end of the continuum I can related to - that is, ideally, how I would like to deal with all projects. The reality is different. Right now I have an old floppy drive on my bench. I finished a project last night (making a couple of emergency lights that use wide-angle LEDs) for power outage situations and they have terminals and different current limiting resistors to accommodate all my likely batteries).


Clean work bench -....next. I have an old 5.25 floppy, an MPI, b51, I already wrote about it here. I cleaned it up and it performs well and I use it with my greaseweasel. The thing is, it is a mess....likely some OEM concoction. It should *never* have been mounted vertically- even the manual gives the horizontal orientation as the way it should be mounted. There is some funky cable that is too long and is right up against the ps transformer. The case has been beaten up.

I *should* find an appropriate case and cable and refinish the case. I don't want to do all that...I don't want to keep looking and waiting and spend the $$ and so on. So, I found some clips; folded the cable gently and am attaching the end of the cable to the outside of the case. I bought a can of gloss or semi-gloss and I will sand and spray the enclosure (I really don't have experience with that but it can't look worse than it does now). I plan on being done this week.

This project has become a chore. It's not going to be done "right" and I am hoping for "good enough". I have at least 20 listed projects that I would rather do, but this one is short and has been on the list for too long.

What do you do when fun projects become chores?

 

[syzygy]

IThe downside is i have systems and parts for up to 5 machines laid out which can be a huge clutter and lead to its own chaos.

I keep lists on my computer of most of what i have for components so thst really helps in not having to buy things multiple times by accident.

The first point above - +1 unless they are physically small, I don't have the room to lay out several projects....I end up with stuff everywhere, and it is a problem. Even though I also have multiple projects going on - mostly only one that is completely active.

Your second point - oh hell yes. I'm not completely finished yet, but I have been sorting and listing all the computer and electronics stuff so that items can be found easily. Sterlite containers, labelled boxes and so on. The list is a simple (and quite long) Word file and it get searched quite a bit and it works! No more endless searching for this thing or that - or at least not as much. It is not an obsessive database, it is just enough info to find the thing I am looking for. Agree 100%.

 

[VERAULT]

The first point above - +1 unless they are physically small, I don't have the room to lay out several projects....I end up with stuff everywhere, and it is a problem. Even though I also have multiple projects going on - mostly only one that is completely active.

Your second point - oh hell yes. I'm not completely finished yet, but I have been sorting and listing all the computer and electronics stuff so that items can be found easily. Sterlite containers, labelled boxes and so on. The list is a simple (and quite long) Word file and it get searched quite a bit and it works! No more endless searching for this thing or that - or at least not as much. It is not an obsessive database, it is just enough info to find the thing I am looking for. Agree 100%.

I use compartmentalized Took or tackle containers to sort all my components and ics. I use a dymo label printer to label the compartments on the clear covers for easy identification. The few large containers in those cases have either all diodes, transistors, resistors etc. So I have a small printout with an up to date list of whats in them. If I buy something new I will hand write it in. If I run out I will order them and write down I ordered them, the date, and from where. Its not perfect but it allows me to have a constant inventory so I dont need to always be ordering parts. Guys who have to make purchases for every job they recap seems silly to me. I have all the major caps unless they are an odd size. And thats just caps for example.

As for room. I have a dedicated office/workshop.. But keeping it neat is just like drilling a hole in water. I cant simply work on 1 project at a time thats just impractical. So it is what it is.

 

[seaken]

I'm way more casual. For me it's a hobby. If I don't finish a project, so what? But, at the same time there are some projects that I really want to finish. For instance, I had a NorthStar Advantage just sitting in a pile. I couldn't even see it behind a bunch of other old systems. But it was my first daily driver and I really wanted get it fixed up. When I finally did start the project I stayed with it until it was finished. Now I am happy it is done. But then I wonder "what's next"?

It usually comes down to a failure in equipment. I turn on the system and something is wrong. That becomes my new project. Or I get a new system at the surplus center.

And I also usually have at least two or three projects open on my work bench at the same time. Sometimes it sits there for months until I finally either figure it out or move it off the work bench to make room for something else.

I keep a record of my projects and I do a blog posting once in a while. I also try to organize my software, both on my servers and in physical media. But I don't keep bins of parts in a nicely organized way. Usually, I just rummage through boxes or drawers when looking for something. That would probably drive you guys insane!

Seaken

 

[VERAULT]

Its a hobby for me too.

 

[1944GPW]

I have unfinished projects going back to 1978 that I still get out occasionally and work on, can't hurry these things...
I have a zillion of them, of which vintage computing is just one hobby. For instance I must have a few hundred scale model kits to start on sometime, with a few dozen more on the go.
Some my son has built, now. But there's one $2 model I started in the 70s, half-built, put away, broken and lost parts, instructions missing now and I told him "You can work on all the other models. But this one <shakes ziplock bag of sad plastic pieces> is for me alone to tackle". I may or may not get it done over the next 10 years or so.
Years ago I came to the realisation that I'll never finish most them or other projects, and... I don't care. I get enthused, lose interest, regain interest, go yak-shaving 20 levels deep, and none of it matters as long as I enjoy what I'm doing, it doesn't bug me. When I do finish, it's the icing on the cake.

 

[krebizfan]

If I have a project with a good plan for successful completion, I focus on that project until finished. Unfortunately, most of the projects that I complete are for other people.

 

[Porcupine]

I try to avoid multiple projects simultaneously, but it sometimes cannot be helped. One particular reason has not been mentioned yet. Sometimes I get stuck on an 'inexplainable' problem, some weird fault or behavior that I cannot seem to pinpoint and fix. It then often helps to set that issue aside, and let it simmer in the back of your brain. A solution or a new kind of troubleshooting test then often pops in my mind a few days later.
Having said that, I do find myself juggling hardware and software tasks simultaneously. Different tasks for different moods.

 

[syzygy]

When I get stuck, I also try to give it a rest and do something else. Not just to get the "Aha" phenomenon, but just out of respect for latent learning. Also, sometimes it just takes some time to have that piece of hardware or technique or whatever, show up (meaning that I learn about it or hear about it).....where I go, oh I could probably use that thing for that...or I find out that someone makes a 3d version of the part that fixes that.

 

[syzygy]

If I have a project with a good plan for successful completion, I focus on that project until finished......

Oh yeah, that is a big issue for me...not just the plan for successful completion, but a clear definition of completion. With retirement (and the covid years), I had this great sense of reclaiming freedom. I was much more apt to just learn how to use some electronic part...learn the datasheet...breadboard it...program it...done --> repeat. Nothing wrong with that and, I would argue, I taught myself a great deal in a couple of years.

I still have that luxury of figuring out how something works without much caring about building anything...learning how to use the thing, is the project. But at this point, I am trying to take up projects with more thought toward what completion looks like. I don't want to stick anything in the queue without some "triage". I'm not sure that this is a great idea because if you want to learn something, you naturally want to build something that is the result of your learning- there is a connection.

 

[DougM]

I still have that luxury of figuring out how something works without much caring about building anything

I've done that several times - work through all the difficult issues on the project and then set it aside, saying, "the rest is just code" and never get back to it.

There are several phases to projects (not necessarily retro computer projects, but in general) and each one I like at different levels. I love the mechanical+CAM/CADdy part the most, followed by the electronics design part, and then a distant third is the code.

And, being on the cusp of retirement is absolutely wonderful - I have time to dedicate to the backlog as well as a large number of maintenance tasks that had been languishing (honeydo's I'm told they are called) . And the depth and complexity of a project isn't really a limiting factor, although now the cost is.

I'm wrestling a little bit with the best method of documenting them. I'd like to do a build log on all of them, but I don't want to put it on my own website because a month after the bill isn't paid the whole thing will disappear. There are some dedicated forums that I have build logs on for the project specific to the subject matter of that forum, and I guess I could document the rest on Hackaday or similar. Or even just put it all up in Github. Though it would be nice if GitHub had some sort of blogging functionality over the top of the code repository.

Miscellaneous ramblings, sorry.

 

[syzygy]

I'm wrestling a little bit with the best method of documenting them. I'd like to do a build log on all of them, but I don't want to put it on my own website because a month after the bill isn't paid the whole thing will disappear. There are some dedicated forums that I have build logs on for the project specific to the subject matter of that forum, and I guess I could document the rest on Hackaday or similar. Or even just put it all up in Github. Though it would be nice if GitHub had some sort of blogging functionality over the top of the code repository.

Miscellaneous ramblings, sorry.

Not rambling at all. I struggle with documentation as well. I have used various forums and go back to them sometimes to find out how I did something. I am too lazy to maintain a blog. Github is too much of a pita and I have no desire to "further a career" (although I have no trouble using it and am happy so many kind soles write on there).

One thing I have taken to doing is to write up the project as a story. I have done plenty of professional writing and for decades, but it is very specific and not intended for either non-professionals or even professionals in very different fields. I learned, after retirement, that I had literally forgotten how to write in any other style. So, I have generate a number of such stories, with as much an attempt at humor as documentation. Friends who get them may think I am nutz, but they might have thought that before - some say they enjoy them.

I am attaching such a story of my tale of fixing a tablet computer (it turned out that the fix was VERY different that what I thought it was going to be). I understand if you don't take the time to read it, but I just did after a couple of years and actually cracked a smile or two.

 

[doshea]

I don’t mean work that you are paid for (or hope to be paid for) where there are deadlines.

Yeah, deadlines are very helpful for getting things done I've found that my local retro computing group's themed meets give me something to focus on, and a deadline, so I actually get some of those things done that I never started before but always wanted to do.

How do you handle prioritizing?

A combination of what I feel like doing and what I feel like I should be doing, so there can be conflict there!

Do you have a bazillion projects going on all the time?

I'm not aware of any alternatives

Does that “fun” project ever become a burdensome “I should finish that” or does it not bother you at all or something in the middle?

Yes, particularly for some software projects where they might actually be useful to someone else, and I know that my slacking off could potentially cost someone else some wasted time. I suppose it's not a terrible burden though because I'd enjoy finishing things to at least some level of "finished" if I could get there for one of my own projects.

Do you lose interest in that “fun” project and go start another “funner” project?

Far too frequently. I often find myself going back to those things that I think are kind of important for sharing with other people though.

Do you have any tips for such issues?

I suppose one thing that helps me with the software projects is that along the way I put lots of "FIXME" comments in my code for things that I think I need to think about later (but which would distract me from doing the things that are fun and exciting in the moment, like figuring out how something works), and at least when I decide I should try to "finish" something I can grep for those and gradually chip away at them and feel a sense of accomplishment that e.g. I think in the last week I've reduced them from about 75 to about 60 in the project I'm trying to tidy up right now. I'm pretty sure there are a few things on another list, and I'll need to write up some documentation too so I don't make one of those projects we hate, but I'd better try not to think about all those things or I'll get discouraged :D

 

[DeltaDon]

I try to work on only as many projects as I can keep track of their progress in my head. So if I'm waiting on parts for one project I will work on others, but when I've got projects scattered everywhere in various states of disrepair it's time to finish a few before even thinking about starting others. I use cardboard storage boxes or bins to hold work in progress. I've been stacking any small test equipment in storage bins with all their cables and accessories. So if a device needs a power brick, a USB cable and some other stuff - it all goes in the bin. No more sharing USB cables or power cords which just leads to long searches looking for a $2 cable. I have a couple of Brother label makers (narrow and wide tapes) to label everything so I know what's in a bin and what stuff goes with in with what device. I also have several Arko Mills and other brands of drawer type storage cabinets full of IC's, Cap's and resistors. All labeled. My biggest problem is what's left of my closed laptop business inventory that got shuffled around by my hired moving company when I moved cross country. So it is all mixed up. I'm slowly working through a 1,000 sq ft of bins full of mixed up laptop parts. But that's a lifetime's effort on it's own, guessing what small cable goes with what laptop and may never be completed.

 

[jlang]

When I start a project is gets a Steralite box all it's own. The parts ,code and drawings collect in the box until I have enough to build.
It took 30 years for my Frankenstein PDP-11 and it still needs a chassis. I have several (3-5) projects in process at a time.
Very few of my projects are ever complete. I suffer a bad case of feature creep.

 

[VERAULT]

Steel rack shelving. A must. I now have 6 of these. Two in my office and 4 in the basement (granted one of them is more of a pantry at this point). But this was the best for storing CRTS, computers, and large items. Im also building (slowly) wrap around wood shelving around the upper perimiter of my office for small items like Commodore computers, floppy drives, amigas, etc. I plan to wrap the room in them at some point.

steek racks

 

[DougM]

I put lots of "FIXME" comments in my code for things that I think I need to think about later

This! I have a fixes.txt in all of my project folders. That way I don't lose track of what I need to improve. Several times I have made changes to and then ordered a board only to realize when I receive it that I totally forgot one thing. big waste of $$