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Sort of. There's no original UNIX code in Linux, as far as I can tell. Call it a sort-of-workalike. How about binary compatibility--I never checked that one out?
Did Euler have any interaction with AT&T?
 
Well, Linux DOES have been certified as an official UNIX, it just was not done so by an USA corporation.

Huawei did get its Eurler 2.0 Linux system certified as UNIX. Euler 2.0 is a recompile of CentOS 7, which is a recompile of RedHat 7. Therefore, for practical purposes, RedHat 7 is UNIX.

So yes, nowadays Linux is UNIX.

Linux is not Unix, or vice versa. The only thing they have in common is they're both POSIX style operating systems.

SCO tried to claim this back in 2009-2011, saying that Linux contained patented Unix code in the kernel. Forensic code analysis was done and not a shred of Unix code was found to be present in the Linux kernel. But in addition to that, they incurred the wrath of Novell when they claimed they held the rights to Unix. Novell put them in their place, SCO had only licensed Unix from Novell, they didn't buy the rights.

SCO is now dead and gone, bankrupt. Who knew trying to extort the entire world with threatening license fees to use Linux, and suing their own customers for using Linux would end badly for them. Their contempt and greed was their downfall.

Sort of. There's no original UNIX code in Linux, as far as I can tell. Call it a sort-of-workalike. How about binary compatibility--I never checked that one out?
Did Euler have any interaction with AT&T?

There's no Unix code in Linux, and there never was. It was a fever dream by SCO executives trying to extort billions of people for licensing fees for using Linux. They're both POSIX operating systems that share some UI features and design principles so they look similar.

Binary compatibility is possible through emulation layers. It's been forever since I've run BSD, but there was a program called alien that could convert Linux packages into Unix compatible packages.
 
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FWIW, XFCE is the default for Debian nowadays; it's pretty much been my desktop since the Gnome project started screwing up. It's relatively lightweight and intuitive.
I should add that Debian is the kernel base for a vast number of distros--and is pretty conservative, or, at least it used to be.
I still run Debian (I switched from Ubuntu, my first Linux, years ago) and yes it's still quite conservative. (I like that; I normally don't need the latest versions of software, and when I do I need the really latest and build it myself anyway.)

I don't use that bloated XFCE desktop, though; I just use Fvwm2 with a few extra utilities (well, which includes xfce4-panel :)). And that's already two steps into bloat; I switched from Fvwm1 about 15-20 years ago, and from twm another six or seven years before that.

Sadly, if you run Chrome all the rest makes basically no difference.

Well, Linux DOES have been certified as an official UNIX, it just was not done so by an USA corporation.
...
So yes, nowadays Linux is UNIX.
I very much doubt that. I expect, as others have said, Linux was POSIX-certified. Repeat after me: "UNIX is a trademark of Bell Laboratories" (or whomever owns it now); saying that Linux is UNIX is like saying that Pepsi is Coke.
 
Euler has seeked POSIX 03 conformance back 5 years ago.
It's really not that hard to make any current *nix POSIX 03 conformant because they're already there. 03 was a long time ago.

There isn't a single version of Linux kernel that's POSIX compliant nor there is a single version of GNU userland. GNU's intentionally not compliant. Huawei made changes and put their code up for certification.

Systems such as Linux distributions and BSDs can be altered, brought to conformance and certified but nobody is doing that just for the sake of it. A time consuming, expensive, recurring process against someone else's standards body.

Linux is not Unix, or vice versa. The only thing they have in common is they're both POSIX style operating systems.

SCO tried to claim this back in 2009-2011, saying that Linux contained patented Unix code in the kernel. Forensic code analysis was done and not a shred of Unix code was found to be present in the Linux kernel. But in addition to that, they incurred the wrath of Novell when they claimed they held the rights to Unix. Novell put them in their place, SCO had only licensed Unix from Novell, they didn't buy the rights.

SCO is now dead and gone, bankrupt. Who knew trying to extort the entire world with threatening license fees to use Linux, and suing their own customers for using Linux would end badly for them. Their contempt and greed was their downfall.

There's no Unix code in Linux, and there never was. It was a fever dream by SCO executives trying to extort billions of people for licensing fees for using Linux. They're both POSIX operating systems that share some UI features and design principles so they look similar.

Binary compatibility is possible through emulation layers. It's been forever since I've run BSD, but there was a program called alien that could convert Linux packages into Unix compatible packages.

Lets drop in a bit of context here about the claim that Linux is UNIX.

- Linux is not an OS, it's an OS kernel, useless without init system, shells, and standard OS tools called the userland
- Torvalds used MINIX book and source in order to make a Unix-type operating system kernel that can run GNU userland
- GNU means "GNU's not Unix"
- The resulting operating system is actually called GNU/Linux
- There are other operating systems with GNU userland but without Linux kernel, mainly Debian/kFreeBSD.
- There could be other operating systems with Linux kernel but without GNU userland, mainly embedded.

Therefore no original UNIX source was used in the beginning in any aspect, kernel or userland.
GNU's name isn't a joke only, it's a outlook of philosophy too; they've modified stuff, long options come to mind, GNU-style make comes to mind and many others. This is intentionally not Unix compliant.

Now in BSD world, it's completely different. The system used to be full UNIX due to it being sourced from AT&T SysV via academic license. Still in that ecosystem, Berkeley made 386BSD version, which is that UNIX running in Intel. 386BSD was used as starting point for FreeBSD 1, NetBSD 1, and BSDi the commercial OS - the latter caused the lawsuit from AT&T because BSDi was commercializing System V code that was granted under academic license.

AT&T succeeded and BSDi had to legally move to 4.4BSD-lite, which is 386BSD with refactored parts of proprietary code. Through the conclusion of the lawsuit, FreeBSD and NetBSD were 'recommended' to move to 4.4BSD codebase too.

So around 1993 we have three clean Unix-like implementations that have no UNIX in the source code whatsover. GNU/Linux, FreeBSD and NetBSD.

The UNIX trademark was eventually acquired by Santa Cruz and culminated in infamous SCO vs Linux lawsuit. SCO tried to claim API design as proprietary. Kinda the same thing Oracle tried to do with Java later on.

FreeBSD 5.5?

There's the Intel Binary Compatibility Standard (iBCS) which Linux implements (or at least used to, could've been removed for all I know). I'm not sure how effective it is though.

Yes.

FreeBSD since version 4 implements the Linux compatibility layer.

It translates syscalls and other kernel interface differences between Linux and BSD, both systems are Unix types and use same type of executable and runtime linker so just translation is needed. This allows to implement a Linux compatible kernel in FreeBSD so one can just install the appropriate userland and to desired 3rd party applications.

With FreeBSD 5.5 RH 7.2 and RH 8 userlands were available. They are currently not available for remote install because Red Hat moved them somewhere.

The support versioning is whatever release of glibc can run under the simulated kernel. From there you can derive what 'distros' you can use down on the filesystem. Although none are necessary - Linux apps can work against FreeBSD libs too.

This is what I'll be testing next - the 3D game support on TNT2 on this PC. Linux 3D games usually don't even need an Linux userland to run. Official nVidia drivers expose the Linux-type libGL.

I like messing with this, you might've figured the Windowmaker WM up there, NeXTSTEP is absolutely my favourite GUI ever, I still use Windowmaker to this day on my main PC, but on SVGA resolutions it just looks wonderful as it should. And some of the dockapps (the widgets for desktop) do not compile anymore, too old codebase. I want a fishbowl clock back on my desktop.
 
Old versions of Debian (2.x) or NetBSD (1.5ish) - are very rough to install and it's easy to screw up. I remember FreeBSD 4.x to be easier to set up. Apple had MacOS X certified as a proper UNIX at some point.

Redhat 5.2 was first non-Microsoft OS I ever installed, it had TUI installer but you had to drop down to shell 3 or 4 times to make 'fixes'...those were written down on paper for me by the person giving me the CD. I guess that's quite rough to install if you don't have right instructions. I vaguely remember parts of it were for X11.

OpenBSD used to be, and probably still is, the most frightening because of the IBM setup alike install with manual partition steps.
 
Knoppix was painless to get going - literally zero effort, and it detected all of my hardware. I was able to mount some Sun Solaris disks and get what I needed off of them. So for anyone with similar requirements to my original post, give Knoppix 5.1.1 a try.

mike
 
...that's more a political move than a practical one. If I were to take one of my SysVR4 tapes here and look for source code in Euler that was identical, how successful will I be?
It's also a practical issue because to get the UNIX certification by The Open Group, your system has to pass the test suites for the Single Unix Specification which The Open Group maintains.

Political is the will the pass the tests, technical is the ability to do so successfully, and economical is to have the pockets to pay for the privilege.
 
Test suites are like benchmarks. There are lies, damned lies and benchmarks/test suites.
Is a fiberglass and resin recreation of a 1969 Mustang a 1969 Mustang?
 
Linux may not be Unix. But Euler Linux 2.0, which is a recompile of CentOS 7, is UNIX, because The Open Group has certified it to be so.

It doesn't matter who recompiles Linux, it does not make it Unix.

That'd like be saying some random company recompiled Windows and it is now Linux because random person said so.

It's complete nonsense.
 
It doesn't matter who recompiles Linux, it does not make it Unix.
That'd like be saying some random company recompiled Windows and it is now Linux because random person said so.
No, it doesn't matter who recompiles it, it matters what the Open Group certifies.

UNIX™ is a trademark currently owned by The Open Group. Thus, they decide what is and isn't UNIX. They've decided that anything that conforms with the Single UNIX Specification and which has passed a certification process for that can have the UNIX label on it. (Just to increase confusion, anything certified as conforming to version 4 of the SUS can be marked "UNIX V7," which is obviously a very different thing from "V7 UNIX.")

Note that this does not require any particular source code; you can write your own fresh OS from scratch and get it certified as "UNIX":

Interestingly enough, as of the Unix95 standard, an operating system does not have to use or license any of the original AT&T Unix source code in order to be certified as a trademarked Unix. IBM’s OS/390 V2R4, for instance, is Unix 95-certified, yet it contains none of the Unix System V Release 4 code.

(And yes, this directly contradicts my previous answer above; I obviously hadn't been paying attention to where the trademark went as the original Unix source code was sold and traded around here and there and what the owners were doing with it.)
 
This also does not mean Linux or GNU is POSIX certified, it means Euler did local modifications that make it certifiable.
Same as with Apple's certification. FreeBSD userland is not directly POSIX certifiable nor is the CMU Mach microkernel, but modified and integrated they make Darwin.

Euler came out few years ago, and it was certified for Single Unix Specification version 3, POSIX-1.2001
It's a twenty year old standard. I'm doing a conjecture here, Huawei had to certify due to telecommunications regulations.

There is absolutely no point in claiming a modern Unix-type system is really UNIX because it can with slight to medium modifications pass certification for a 20 year old UNIX standard.

GNU/Linux distributions are not UNIX, that's a dead stop there, a fact.
You can compile your own GNU/POSIX/Linux system and certify it like Euler did.

If you really want to go this route, then Windows is UNIX too. There was SFU on NT, and at least one build got certified - again because Microsoft wanted a business contract that requires POSIX certification.
 
Unix and UNIX are actually interchangable, most of the original unixen were uppercase but there was at least major one that wasn't, Research Unix.

There were Unix-like systems in the 80s, same situation as GNU/Linux in 90s, wrote to spec mostly but not fully and not certified. "Unix-like" was a term from back then, from before "Unix Wars". It was not coined to describe open sources BSDs and Linux distros.

What is certified as UNIX, is UNIX.

I'm going to hard disagree on that, but in a given context;
Microsoft has certified a certain NT kernel with Services For Unix userland with The Open Group in order to bid an aviation contract. That exact build of Windows is sure to host all POSIX compliant tools that developers on the said contract expect; it was made for that reason, to comply with APIs, not to rework Windows in vain of something far more important than The Open Group buerocracy paperworks, the Unix philosophy.

Currently it is possible to certify a system that's completely against the Unix rules and dogma.

Rest assured, BSDs are far more Unix than UNIX(TM) EulerOS although it's not far being a Linux. Linux that has systemd, wayland and every second thing that goes breaking the old Unix philosophy. The "Linux people" pushing for these developments do not want ties to Unix, they see that as needless backward compatibility. Systemd leader has been vocal about this.

If it has 4 legs and tail, it's a dog no matter the label "duck" on its harness
 
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