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Transfer files from a REAL PDP8E and SIMh

Well..... interesting. I'm not very familiar with the PDP8 disk drive interface stuff, but I think the solution maybe to use Kyle's procedure and use BUILD in Simh to add Kyle's SerialDisk. Now that probably sounds a lot easier than it might be. But it's a shot. Thanks Mike
 
Start to horse around with Simh build. Here is what I did
Code: 
.RUN SYS BUILD

$PO\O\R

KL8E: *TTY
R2SY: *SYS
R0AB: *R20A *R20B
R0CD: *R20C *R20D
R01E:  R20E  R21E
R1AB: *R21A *R21B
R1CD: *R21C *R21D
RK05: *RKA0 *RKB0  RKA1  RKB1  RKA2  RKB2  RKA3  RKB3
$UN R2SY

$PR

KL8E: *TTY
R0AB: *R20A *R20B
R0CD: *R20C *R20D
R01E:  R20E  R21E
R1AB: *R21A *R21B
R1CD: *R21C *R21D
RK05: *RKA0 *RKB0  RKA1  RKB1  RKA2  RKB2  RKA3  RKB3
$UN ROAB,ROCD
ROAB NOT FOUND
$UN R0AB,R0CD
?SYNTAX
$I\I\UN R0AB

$UN R0CD

$PR

KL8E: *TTY
R01E:  R20E  R21E
R1AB: *R21A *R21B
R1CD: *R21C *R21D
RK05: *RKA0 *RKB0  RKA1  RKB1  RKA2  RKB2  RKA3  RKB3
$LO SYS:DSKSYS

$PR

KL8E: *TTY
R01E:  R20E  R21E
R1AB: *R21A *R21B
R1CD: *R21C *R21D
RK05: *RKA0 *RKB0  RKA1  RKB1  RKA2  RKB2  RKA3  RKB3
SDSK:  SYS   SDA0  SDB0
$IN SDSK:SYS,SDA0,SDB0

$LO SYS"\"\:DSKNSY

$IN SDSK:SDA1,SDB1

$DSK=SYS

$PR

KL8E: *TTY
R01E:  R20E  R21E
R1AB: *R21A *R21B
R1CD: *R21C *R21D
RK05: *RKA0 *RKB0  RKA1  RKB1  RKA2  RKB2  RKA3  RKB3
SDSK: *SYS  *SDA0 *SDB0
SDSK:  SDA0  SDB0 *SDA1 *SDB1

DSK=SDSK:SYS
$BO

Unfortunately when the Boot cammand was given it hung. Yet if I made a mistake like more than 15 handlers or no system it reported the error. Not sure where to go next. Maybe I need to look at the Simh doc's. I wounder if build is disabled? Thanks Mike
 
I thought that I'd try something simple. Just unload R0AB, then BOOT. I got this message

Code: 
Unit not attached, PC: 27733 (DCMA)

sim>

So, maybe the Boot of BUILD doesn't work in Simh?

Thanks Mike
 
Take a peek here: http://avitech.com.au/?page_id=2514 . You may need to do a little preparatory fiddling - I did this a few years back (and, I think, documented it on the forum) but I don't remember that details. I had to install socat on my Pi for sure.

************

Found my write up:

Running SerialDisk (os8diskserver) in virtual mode


Kyle Owen's SerialDisk RK05 'emulator' can be run in stand-alone "virtual" mode, allowing you to load handlers, BUILD system disks, test server code, etc. without the need for any DEC hardware. This has been an on-again/off-again proposition because of a couple of bugs in SIMH that were exposed by Kyle's script but all issues have been resolved with the current (4a47113f) commit and this valuable tool now runs reliably in stand-alone mode. Prepare your disk image on your desk/laptop, transfer it to your server, then load and go on real hardware.


The requisite setup is already in the os8diskserver/SerialDisk/simh directory of Kyle's distribution. You will need to make sure that socat is loaded on your host system and that you have an Xclient on your remote system; for my Windows7 system, I use Xming. 'Make' a fresh instance of the current pdp8 sim, copy it into Kyle's simh directory, load your Xclient, and start the pdp8 program. Kyle's directory already has the appropriate disk.cfg and pdp8.ini files in place.

I've run SerialDisk in this mode using AbsoluteTelnet and PuTTY from my Windows system and from a Ubuntu terminal window in a VirtualBox session.

If SerialDisk seems to hang at "Booting...", you might need to give Xterm a little more time to get ready before sending the boot message to the server. I experienced this with PuTTY and got things to work by increasing the "sleep" interval before booting (line 18 in the pdp8.ini script) from 1 to 5. If you get funny socat errors (socket error 97) or the system hangs while executing the script, be sure you have the latest pdp8 build. If you get an xterm error about loading fonts (e.g. xterm: cannot load font '-misc-fixed-medium-r-semicondensed--13-120-75-75-c-60-iso10646-1'), make sure you have a .Xdefault file in your SerialDisk server home directory.

Thanks to Kyle for this great utility, Crawford Griffith for his help with the .ini script and Mark Pizzalto for super quick turnaround squashing SIMH bugs.
 
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Hello,

to boot os8diskserver with simh I had to do two things:
- one little change to the pdp8.ini : go --> go 17
- make sure you have a simh version V.4, otherwise the "notelnet" ( at ttix 2222;notelnet) does not work. Before I had V3.8-1 on my raspberry.

Of course you need to install socat + xterm:
sudo apt install socat xterm

You need a host with X-Windows and to set the DISPLAY:

export DISPLAY:192.168.0.64:0 (in my case)

and allow a connection to the X-Server:

xhost +

Thats all I had to do. The rest comes with the os8diskserver packet.

Have fun,
Volker
 
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To be perfectly honest, you guys lost me. I'm unsure if I do this stuff that I can accomplish what I want. Just to be clear. I'm trying to relearn Fortran IV. When I'm at home I like to use my real PDP8E with SerialDisk. Many times when I have to go some where I drag my laptop along and then use Simh. So for example if I have a FORT.FT on the PDP8E will I be able to grab this file and use it on the laptop when I do not have access to the Real PDP8? Mike
 
I use serialdisk to copy files from the RK05 on my 8/e to/from a disk image on my desktop machine. Then I can use the disk image with SIMH.
 
Hello Mike,

I would say you have several choices, depending on your equipment. But easiest and fastest is the following:

1. Connect your Laptop with the serial interface of the console from the real PDP. Start Kermit on your Laptop and connect to OS/8. If Kermit is installed start "K12MIT.SV" and transfer files between OS/8 and your Laptop. The Image I'm using has K12MIT installed, maybe you have to look for that.
Then you have the file on your laptop and you can edit it. This would be the way to send the file later on back to the real PDP.

2. How to bring the file from your Laptop to the simh-pdp?
If the file is not too big, I would do this via cut+paste. Mark and cut the code in the Editor of your laptop.
Start a PIP session in simh:

R PIP
*FILE.FT<TTY:

and paste the code. After this is ready type ^Z and finish with ^C. Now you have your file on the disk and you can ".EXE FILE.FT". This always worked for me with simh, but it's a pain on a real pdp8. The way back would be to ".TYPE FILE.FT" and mark+cut in the simh window. Then paste into your editor.


Other possibilities I see at the moment:

- More straight forward would be to use the tool "os8-cp" what is part of the pidp8 project from tangentsoft.com. I installed the pidp8 project software on my MAC laptop and it compiles under MAC OS. With os8-cp you can direct transfer files from rk05 images (or others) to and from your laptop or under each others. I tried with my os8diskserver image and a normal rk05 image.

- You can use the tool putr.exe under DOS to generate RX01 floppy images. You can copy files into them. Then mount the image in your simh as rx01 and you will have access to the data. Same way back. I think this also works in DOS-Box, because you don't access real floppy disks. I'm pretty sure, but never did this, I use an old 486 for that 8" stuff.

- You can start your simh session with the os8diskserver, like Jack described and use the same os8diskserver image on your laptop. Then you have do not need to copy between two pdp systems. You can always work on the same image. Maybe this can be made a little bit easier, without xterm. If you are interested I try this and write it down.

Have fun
Volker
 
m_thompson said:
I use serialdisk to copy files from the RK05 on my 8/e to/from a disk image on my desktop machine. Then I can use the disk image with SIMH.
Click to expand...


Hello,

this is what I don't get to work. When I mount a os8server diskimage and mount it in simh as a second disk, than I can list the files, but cannot access them. Did you make a BUILD to integrate the non_systemhandlers?
 
Thanks, now I noticed my mistake using COPY in OS/8! Sometimes....

Yes this works. Reading/writing both directions.

Volker
 
Well.... I tried the Kermit method suggested by Volker. I did get this to work and most likely will do for me. Yet, I'm interested in the other method of SimH and SerialDisk working together. I've been studying this a little. Please point out anything that I may say that is in error. On my Raspberry PI that I use SerialDisk on (and connects to my PDP8E), I have to add a copy of SimH, Socat and Xterm. Then on my laptop I have at add XClient. The Xterm, XClient and Socat are software that communicates and allows the laptop to contact SerialDisk. So instead of SerialDisck communicating with the PDP8E it will talk to my SimH ? But how can I transfer the RK05 disk image? Mike
 
Hello,

you may copy the os8diskserver diskimage from your raspberry to the laptop. Maybe with scp or any scp client. Then you put it in the folder where the normal simh diskimage (say simh.rk05) is.
When starting simh you mount both images.

at rk0 /path/simh.rk05
at rk1 /path/os8diskserver.rk05
boot rk0

When OS/8 is startet you can access the second disk like:
.DIR RKA1:
.DIR RKB1:

.COPY SYS:FILE.FT < RKB1:FILE.FT
or back
.COPY RKB1:FILE.FT < SYS:FILE.FT

To bring the file out of the simh-session to your laptop, you may mount a file to the printer in simh (^E)
att lpt file.txt
cont
After "cont" you can ".LIST FILE.FT" and it will printed in the file.txt on your laptop.

Once you are ready with your laptop session, you may copy the image back to the raspberry and enjoy the sound and lights of a real pdp8.... If you are using differend names, you always have a backup of your work in progress.

Volker
 
I agree with Volker.

Get an RK05 image that has a bootable OS/8 implementation containing the FORTRAN compiler and utilities you require for your development.

Get this working under SIMH on your PC.

Copy the file containing your serialdisk RK05 image from the RPi to the PC and mount it as the second RK05. DO NOT BOOT FROM THIS DISK but from the native disk you got working with SIMH at first.

Load SIMH and carry on developing - but on your PC. Your source files are on the second RK05 rather than the first (as they will be on your real PDP-8).

Dave
 
Well.... I really appreciate this. I copied my disk image from SerialDisk to my laptop PDP8 directory and changed the PDP8.ini file as you said. I can see my FORT.FT files in both images and can copy them back and forth. BUT, I'm having trouble with the control E part. Control E makes the program jump back to the simh prompt. The statement "Attach lpt file.txt", produces an empty text file on my laptop in the PDP8 directory. Cont returns me to the simulated OS8 prompt (but I have to press, enter twice). Then when I enter LIST FORT.FT, I get an error message LPT DOES NOT EXIST. Does that mean I do not have a LPT handler installed? Thanks a million, Mike
 
You can use the SIMH command:

set console wru=N

to for example set the interrupt character to 'N' where N=1 is ^A, N=2 is ^B, N=5 is ^E (the default)

You can show it as:

show console wru
 
Tried this but it didn't seem to change anything. I added the SET CONSOLE WRU=5 in the PDP8.ini file and ran it, this is what showed.
Code: 
PDP-8 simulator V3.9-0

THIS PDP8E HAS 2 SERIAL PORTS. DEVICE 03/04 CONSOLE RUNNING AT 110 BAUD
DEVICE 40/41 FOR SERIAL DISK, RUNNING AT 38400 BAUD. A 12 BIT I/O
CONNECTED TO THE REMEX PAPER TAPE.

32K MEMORY!
OS/8 - KBM V3T - CCL V3E

.
Simulation stopped, PC: 01207 (KSF)
sim> att lpt file.txt
sim> cont

.LIST INT.FT
LPT DOES NOT EXIST

.
Simulation stopped, PC: 01210 (JMP 1207)
sim> show console wru
WRU = 5

Mike
 
It won't, because WRU = 5 (^E) is the default. You want to set it to something else like WRU = 1 (^A) so you can then type ^E without breaking into SIMH ...

AND by the way v3.9-0 is a VERY OLD version of SIMH ...
 
I'm also using "^E" for breaking into simh console, for changing the file for the printer (det/att). Than "cont" for countinue simulation.
It really seem you have no printer installed in your OS/8. You see the devices with ".RES". In the output I see a LPT.

Maybe you try a different image? I think the diag-games-kermit.rk05 that comes with the os8diskserver in the ..../disks/original folder has LPT installed. You may try this as the first disk.
 
Doesn't look like the LPT is installed.
Code: 
PDP-8 simulator V3.9-0

THIS PDP8E HAS 2 SERIAL PORTS. DEVICE 03/04 CONSOLE RUNNING AT 110 BAUD
DEVICE 40/41 FOR SERIAL DISK, RUNNING AT 38400 BAUD. A 12 BIT I/O
CONNECTED TO THE REMEX PAPER TAPE.

32K MEMORY!
OS/8 - KBM V3T - CCL V3E

.RES
SYS,DSK,BAT,TTY,RKA0,RKB0,RKA1,RKB1,RKA2,RKB2,RXA0,RXA1,B3,B4

I'll try TTY. Mike

TTY doesn't work.
 
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