• Please review our updated Terms and Rules here

Good 8-bit kit for beginner?

chreeg11

New Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2023
Messages
6
Hi All,
I was wanting to build a kit for either a 6800, 6502, or 8080 CPU and wondering if anyone had any recommendations for a beginner? Beginner in terms of electrical engineering experience, definitely comfortable with programming just not verse in the ways of doing my own electronics. Was hoping I could start with a simple kit and go from there?

Thanks,
Chris
 
I know you specified 8080 instead of Z80 but FWIW Jerry Walker on YouTube just did a 30-part series on designing a Z80 trainer board from the ground up, and has also just released a book on it explaining how every little detail works. I think you can get the unpopulated board from his shop. No connection to him, he's just a great channel to follow on YT.
 
I would highly recommend the RC-2014 if you are looking for a self-contained, simple kit to get started with. You can build it in an afternoon or so. It uses a z80 processor and is sold on Tindie. There is a large support group, and many enthusiasts have created their own add-in cards for the unit. If you want to start small - the "Classic II" kit is a perfect place: a basic clock, rom board, ram board, cpu board, and serial com board. Advanced users typically upgrade the memory and add boards to run CPM, so if you know you will want to upgrade, you might save some money looking at some of the other kits they offer. I've built a number of the boards, and the shipping/communication with the seller has been OK in my experience.
 
Everyone has different definitions of simple, I like the RC2014 for Z80 because it can be quite simple or quite feature rich depending on how you build yours. I ended up building a RC2014 Pro with an HDMI terminal, Wifi card, and Commodore 64 keyboard.

6502 Wise I like the Replica 1 Plus from Briel Computers, which is essentially an apple-1 clone. Less building than an RC2014, less customizable, but a worthwihle project. I'd consider it pretty beginner friendly.
 
If you go with the RC2014, just remember that the backplane has 40 pins per position, but some of the cards only have 39 pins per position. If you don't realize this and plug the card in 1-pin off, you'll destroy something. In my case it was the Z80 CPU. It's a cool project and I have nothing but respect for the designer in general, but that was one of the dumbest design decisions ever lol.
 
If you go with the RC2014, just remember that the backplane has 40 pins per position, but some of the cards only have 39 pins per position. If you don't realize this and plug the card in 1-pin off, you'll destroy something. In my case it was the Z80 CPU. It's a cool project and I have nothing but respect for the designer in general, but that was one of the dumbest design decisions ever lol.
Wow yikes thanks for the heads up/tip!
 
with what you can do with the adwater altair 8800 you won't even want to deal with a real one.
 
with what you can do with the adwater altair 8800 you won't even want to deal with a real one.

It's very pretty and all, but technically it's an emulator in a pretty case. And, you know, different strokes for different folks, if that doesn't bother you then I'm sure it's a lot less hassle to set up (and a metric **sload less money to acquire) than an actual 8800 replica, let alone an original unit, with similar capabilities. Where I suppose I'd argue it's not the best choice in the world is if you're actually wanting to build (with hope of understanding) an *actual* 8-bit computer from the ground up, vs. just learning how to *use* one. I mean, ultimately it's kind of a cosplay, albeit a pretty convincing one.

I'd agree that RC2014 is a solid recommendation. Conceptually it's pretty comparable to an Altair-style S-100 machine, in being completely modular and thereby giving you the freedom to mix-and-match boards to build whatever you want, be it a minimal embedded system with a serial console or a full-fledged CP/M machine with extended memory, various video console options, etc. The advantage it has over going straight to an S100 replica is the bus and cards are much smaller and cheaper, having been designed around the reality that in the modern era you can, for instance, fit all the memory you might need for an 8-bit computer into a couple chips vs. multiple 5x10" boards. There are also a ton of software options in terms of ROM languages, cross-compilers, and OSes bootable from ROM/flash (CP/M and others) to fit the hardware, so if your ambitions don't extend as far as writing all your software from scratch there's a lot to keep you busy.

Personally I'd steer away from Apple I replicas. Brass tacks, there just isn't that much you can do with one; the computer is an extremely crude design with a dog slow console (which most kits don't even replicate in hardware, they include a microcontroller programmed to handle terminal functions, or just expose a serial port instead), there are only a few dozen programs for it, and most of them are pretty trival (even the BASIC doesn't really work, missing things like a proper SAVE command). Unless you're specifically a huge Apple fanboy there are better options for simple 6502 SBCs.

Grant Searle's webpage has already been mentioned, it you want to just dive right in and do it from scratch on a breadboard that's another option. RC2014 in its most basic forms borrows a lot from Grant's '9 chip CP/M' and simpler BASIC-only version. (A "default" BASIC for Z80-based RC2014 machines is Grant's hacked version of Microsoft's BASIC for the NASCOM 2 computer, as used in these machines.) Another option, if you want a complete tutorial, might be to watch Ben Eater's YouTube series on building a 6502 computer from scratch; he walks through all the moving parts in gruesome detail.

Another thing to note, I guess, is that some vintage computers are pretty hacker friendly with accessible bus connectors, so if you want to start out with learning how to interface and build simple peripherals you could do worse than lay hands on, say, a Commodore PET, a TRS-80, Apple II(+), or a PC/XT compatible. ISA prototyping cards are easily found and electrically speaking it's a pretty forgiving bus. (Although of course you are risking letting the magic smoke out of the computer if you mess up. This is where older is better; most of what you could blow up in an IBM 5160 or TRS-80 is generic TTL and can be replaced with modern parts, while with newer machines you're kind of SOL if you blow up a proprietary chipset component.)
 
Last edited:
If I was wanting an Altair (or similar) I'd want it to be an 8080 or Z80 inside. Not an Arduino. Looks nice, but isn't really it is it? Different strokes though.
 
Another interesting choice would be the IBM-compatible kits like the Micro8088 or Homebrew8088. This offers access to a broader software and peripheral ecosystem than projects like RC2014, and you can bootstrap the project with vintage I/O and video cards, replacing them with home-made alternatives as your skills improve. (I fully intended to learn SMD soldering to build Sergey's VGA card, but found someone who prepped half-assembled kits with the SMD work done. :) )
 
IMOHO, among the simplest (in terms of architecture) of the 8 bitters was the RCA CDP 1802 "COSMAC ELF". I'm not aware of any current production.
 
There is an ebay seller in Thailand who makes an amazing array of computer kits based on all kinds of different CPU's Z80 ,8086 8088 6502. 68008 etc, etc . They look very good to me, this is one of them, but go to his store for the rest:

 
Last edited:
Back
Top