TanruNomad
Veteran Member
I've also heard that 98% of the VIC-20's program library consisted of games.
I think that percentage is more like 99.8% and for the c64, 99.9%.
I've also heard that 98% of the VIC-20's program library consisted of games.
In the late '70s it would be mass produced non-hobby computers for consumer use. The Apple II, VIC-20, and TRS-80 all fall into that category.It depends on what you consider "mass market".
It depends on what you consider "mass market". The first Apple computer squarely aimed at home use was the IIc in 1984. The II+ and IIe were school and business machines, and did not sell well to consumers because they were too expensive (more expensive, in fact, than even the IBM PC!).
The first actual "mass market" computer sold at retail stores like K-Mart was the Commodore VIC-20, which was also the home computer to sell a million units. I've also heard that 98% of the VIC-20's program library consisted of games.
So while the Apple II series was highly influential, the real truth is that Apple was never a sales leader, and in fact never has been when it comes to computers. The Apple II is the computer that almost everybody used in school in the 1980s (except in Texas where Radio Shack/Tandy had a strong local influence), but almost nobody used at home.
Did you just relegate the Commodore computers to toys? Little play things and not a real computer? Oh man, good thing I'm an Apple II fan...and the other players like Commodore ended up in Toys R' Us.
No, the real truth is that Apple did extremely well in the home/consumer market. Like Commodore, the Apple II was a significant player, right up until cheap IBM compatible PC clones came along and saturated the market.
In 1982, Apple sold 300,000 Apple IIs, while Commodore sold 800,000 VIC-20s.
And in the early years, Apple was barely a blip on the radar. It took a long time for them to gather momentum.
In 1982, Apple sold 300,000 Apple IIs, while Commodore sold 800,000 VIC-20s.
I have emailed the author for the source of his data without success (or reply). No data, no foundation to stand on. BTW, I am not disputing his numbers, I just want to see the source. And without a clear understanding of the impact of Apple II clones we will never know market share of the Apple II platform. IIRC, the TRS was also cloned, but AFAIK the Commodores were never cloned. The low price and custom chips didn't invite cloners. The relative high price and openness of the Altair, Apple, and IBM PC invited a lot of competition from clones.Here is some collaborating info here.
http://arstechnica.com/features/2005/12/total-share/3/
What is your point? 300,000 is not a failure. Especially at the price they were sold. I'm sure in the same year Ford outsold Mercedes in the US.
What started this thread was my statement that the Apple II was the first mass market consumer color computer--it was made for games. And that is exactly what Woz was thinking. And the context for that statement goes back to the original poster that was looking to add an Apple II system to his gaming museum.
Again you are glorifying Apple a little too much. Yes, the Apple II series was long-lived, but the Commodore 64 is the world's best-selling computer of all time, so if you define "success" as sales, your statement is incorrect (even with the clones thrown in).I'm a bit confused as to the relevance of VIC and TRS sales figures. The Apple II was manufactured and sold until 1993. A 16 year period. And if you throw in the 100 or so clones you have without a doubt the most successful 8-bit platform--ever.
It is a fact that that first "mass market" computer, sold at mass merchandise retailers, was the VIC-20. Look, I'm not a fan of the machine -- I think it's chunky, ugly, and not really good at anything except reminding you of how the C64 is so much better -- but that is its due place in computing history.
You know, Tandy had Radio Shack stores all over the place at the time the TRS-80 was being sold--you could find one in virtually any mall. My town (not all that big) still has three. My first major purchase at my local RS wasn't a computer--it was an all-band portable radio. I'd call that mass market.
Look, don't take this the wrong way, but you walked into an antique car show and said, "Hi, no idea what a car is - which one is the best? I want to collect it." Now the other collectors are arguing amongst themselves. This should not surprise you.Uuuuummmmm.