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KAYPRO and KayFreHD as a hard disk module

I *FINALLY* ordered all of the parts. I do have geneb's boards here already, but I had none of the parts, so they are on the way (well, Tuesday since Monday is a holiday). Hopefully I didn't forget anything this time like I normally do.
 
and now I FINALLY got a chance to solder it all together.

I present to everyone, 1 assembled FreHD and one assembled "geneb board":
kaypro-frehd.jpg
 
That is the question. I actually need to go back and review how the software is supposed to work because right now I have no idea. That and solder the header onto the Kaypro mobo.
 
mikerm said:
That is the question. I actually need to go back and review how the software is supposed to work because right now I have no idea. That and solder the header onto the Kaypro mobo.
Click to expand...

Mike, did you ever get your FreHD working? I am at the same place you were at last November. I have the boards done and my FreHD is working fine with my RS Model 4. I have the Kayplus ROM in my Kaypro but to to get the FreHD working will require re-compiling the PIC code. Have you got that far? Do you have a hex file?
 
There's no firmware changes to make if you use the adapter board Mike is using. It does require the 50 pin interface on the Kaypro's main board though. The parts will be populated on the Kaypro 10. If your Kaypro has a universal board, you should be able to just populate the empty parts and go.

As far as I know the firmware tweak is only needed for the CPU socket interface. I'm not sure though.

g.
 
geneb said:
There's no firmware changes to make if you use the adapter board Mike is using. It does require the 50 pin interface on the Kaypro's main board though. The parts will be populated on the Kaypro 10. If your Kaypro has a universal board, you should be able to just populate the empty parts and go.

As far as I know the firmware tweak is only needed for the CPU socket interface. I'm not sure though.

g.
Click to expand...

My Kaypro is a 10 with the universal board and it has the expansion connector on the mainboard. I have Geneb's board and I have made a Kayplus ROM which comes up but my understanding from reading all the posts in this thread and and in particular Jaq's blog, is that you need firmware revision 2.14 for the PIC. I have revision 2.13 which does not have the upgrades for the Kaypro, in particular the different sized sectors. I will keep plugging away at this and keep the thread updated. I am about to make a disk with the Kayplus utilities so that I can create a Kayplus boot disk. Once that is done I should know whether or not version 2.13 works but I seriously doubt it!
 
geneb said:
There's no firmware changes to make if you use the adapter board Mike is using. It does require the 50 pin interface on the Kaypro's main board though. The parts will be populated on the Kaypro 10. If your Kaypro has a universal board, you should be able to just populate the empty parts and go.

As far as I know the firmware tweak is only needed for the CPU socket interface. I'm not sure though.

g.
Click to expand...

While you might be able to convince Kayplus or Advent to format your hard disk image with 256 byte sectors (TRS-80 Style) you really should use version 2.14 of the FreHD firmware for the Kaypro. This version adds support for sector sizes other than 256 bytes. You can pick it up from my blog at http://www.quicktrip.co.nz/jaqblog/home/90-kprofrehd2 or from Ian Mavric's download page at http://ianmav.customer.netspace.net.au/trs80/downloads.htm.

When Frank S and I did the original FreHD/Kaypro work we found that the Kayplus ROM had some "interesting behaviours" (I will have to check the emails to find the details) and that the Advent TurboROM worked better.

Hope this helps.
 
The firmware is pretty easy to update - it pulls from the SD card doesn't it?

I haven't found an Advent TurboROM for a Universal board, so if you've got one I'd love to get my hands on the image!

g.
 
jaquinn said:
While you might be able to convince Kayplus or Advent to format your hard disk image with 256 byte sectors (TRS-80 Style) you really should use version 2.14 of the FreHD firmware for the Kaypro. This version adds support for sector sizes other than 256 bytes. You can pick it up from my blog at http://www.quicktrip.co.nz/jaqblog/home/90-kprofrehd2 or from Ian Mavric's download page at http://ianmav.customer.netspace.net.au/trs80/downloads.htm.

When Frank S and I did the original FreHD/Kaypro work we found that the Kayplus ROM had some "interesting behaviours" (I will have to check the emails to find the details) and that the Advent TurboROM worked better.

Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Yes, it does! You confirm what I understood from your blogs. Thanks for all the hard work you did sorting things out. Now onwards and hopefully upwards with getting it all to work.
 
geneb said:
The firmware is pretty easy to update - it pulls from the SD card doesn't it?
Click to expand...

The FreHD won't do this automatically but if you have a TRS-80 then you can use FUPDATE to do this. Alternatively, if you have a PIC programmer then you can flash the HEX file directly.

geneb said:
I haven't found an Advent TurboROM for a Universal board, so if you've got one I'd love to get my hands on the image!
Click to expand...

The docs suggest that the '84 TurboROM will work fine with a Kaypro 4 using the Universal Board. From the docs.....

1.3.5. Compatibility, Universal ROM

The latest version of the Kaypros are shipped with the Universal
ROM. The TurboROM can be used to replace the Universal ROM,
however there are some compatibility issues:

1. Kaypro 10
The TurboROM is directly compatible with the "pre-
Universal ROM" Kaypro 10. The "Universal ROM" Kaypro 10
hard disk drive must be re-formatted to either the early
Kaypro 10 format or one of the Advent Hard disk formats.

2. Application Software
The TurboROM follows Kaypro's early treatment and usage
of the arrow and keypad keys. Several of the Universal
ROM application programs are specific to the Universal
ROM. We have provided patches for WordStar and are
working on patches for other Universal ROM application
software. The simplest solution to bundled software
compatibility would be to use pre-Universal ROM software.


I only have a Kaypro 4/83 here with the 81-240-n board so can't test to be sure. Unfortunately Kaypro are pretty rare here in New Zealand. I have looked on eBay from time to time in search of a universal PCB to play with but no luck so far. It would cost too much to ship a complete machine down here.
 
My FreHD works great with my Model 4, so I should be able to run the FUPDATE program without any problems.

I've got a universal board 4/84 that I'd be happy to test the Advent ROM on, but like I mentioned before, I need an image so I can make one... I take that back, I just dug into the ROM archive on retroarchive.org and found this:

trom34.rom 8192 ROM Kaypro 2X/4/84 monitor Advent TurboROM

I'll get some 8K EPROMs ordered today.

Does the Advent Turbo ROM require custom boot disks like the Kayplus ROM does?

g.
 
Hi All,
for the Advent ROM 3.4 (Kaypro 84) i found a set of images for the SD-Card.
I packed it together with the ROM-Image in an ZIP-File.
Since a long time passed without working with the Kaypros i have no idea, if the files are working fine.
For those who want this, please sent me a mail to mail@schieschke.de.

Regards,
Frank
 
geneb said:
Does the Advent Turbo ROM require custom boot disks like the Kayplus ROM does?
Click to expand...

Yes it does. It supports Autoboot so your fastest route is to send a note to Frank and he can send you an image that is already configured.

If you want to go through the process from from the start then download the set of files from http://planemo.org/retro/downloads/kaypro/TurboRom_Kaypro_4.zip. This isn't FreHD specific but it collects together all the documentation. There is also an Advent System Disk listed at http://www.retroarchive.org/maslin/disks/kaypro/ which also has the documentation.

Note that all this is for the 4/84 machines. The 4/83 and Kaypro II have a smaller ROM and a different version of the Advent ROM is required.
 
It's embarrassing when people send me links to my own website. :)

I don't have any 2764s in stock, but I've got a pile of 27256s. I may craft up some multi-boot roms to play with since I can fit four images into a '256.

g.
 
The boards haven't come in from Osh Park yet. I don't have time to craft up the four-ROM idea, so I may just order some 8k ROMs in a couple of weeks and burn an Advent for my Kaypro 10 (it's got a failing HD).

g.
 
Hi, all! I now have firmware 2.14 loaded in my FreHD and with Geneb's board and the Kayplus Rom I can sort of access the FreHD. The image files that Fred sent me do not work unfortunately. Hdcnfg simply could not find the FreHD. So then I tried the CP/M image for the TRS80 and this time hdcnfg did find the FreHD and appeared to successfully perform all of the formatting and initializing routines. The leds on the FreHD were flashing indicating an ongoing conversation but interestingly not during formatting. They were flashing merrily when hdcnfg was looking for bad blocks though. Hdcnfg will not confirm the interface however, reporting failure and not giving me what is supposed to be an "aproximate location of the problem" error message, to quote the Kayplus manual. Exiting the hdcnfg program, however, leaves me high and dry. The drives do not appear to exist to CP/M so sysgen fails as does any attempt to read one of the hard drives. I think the problem lies with the SD images rather than the hardware. Fred, if you read this could you advise how I go about getting or making appropriate images.
 
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