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Why buying any modern Apple Product is just a terrible idea.

Apple has to pretend to care about their customers. Can't get a 30% margin without that. I think Apple has been more or less following the old HP marketing concept of making the new machine so much better that older but still working machines get shoved in a drawer. When Apple was producing complete junk, Apple was losing money.
 
Not sure about that. Apple has become a fashion statement for the general public.
 
And just in case time hasnt broken it.. locking it out from future updates certainly ensures it.

Seriously, this is pretty ridiculous. Not only is a 2012 iPad five times slower than a five year old Intel laptop, it's far less than 1/10th as fast as the slowest iPad that's supported by the current version of iPad OS. (17, which supports most iPad hardware introduced since 2017). iPads as old as 2014 (iPad Air 2) have received bugfix updates to iOS 15 and 16 this year. That's 7 to 10 years of support for most devices, which means by broad strokes Apple has actually been extremely good *lately* about not cutting off hardware that's pretty darn old by mobile device standards.

I mean, sure, I get being somewhat butthurt that your particular iPad was cut off from new OS releases after only three years, but in response:

A: You *do* understand how crap your average Android vendor is, right? My 2012 Samsung Galaxy Note got *one* operating system update about a year and a half after release. One. My first Android phone, the *absolutely wonderful for the time* 2010 HTC Droid Incredible was updated from Android 2.1 to... 2.2, a few months later. That's it. An abortive attempt to get it to 2.3 came out a year later, but some people never got it.(* this is what got me into jailbreaking and third party OSes for a while) This was absolutely typical in the Android ecosystem for a long time, and for lower end devices from more obscure vendors is still a huge problem.

B: The last version of iOS that 2012 iPad runs actually at least got a security update in 2019, again, seven years after the hardware was introduced. Again, every android from that period? Hell no. Google *kind* of worked around some of this by integrating a lot of security libraries into the Google Play store so you could at least *kind* of get some security fixes direct from Google years after your vendor had abandoned you, but it was far from perfect and wouldn't fix OS-level problems. Again, Apple looks positively saintly here compared to the average for this space.

C: There are, unfortunately, some really good reasons why the lifespans of some of these devices were so short. The technology and performance of mobile devices were improving at a ridiculous super-charged rate for most of the first decade after the first iPhone came out. there are legit reasons why Apple's iOS releases were aggressively cutting off older hardware so quickly for a while; the newer devices just couldn't meaningfully handle them. The longer support windows Apple has now in large part reflect the maturation of mobile platforms as a whole. The CPU (and GPU) speeds are certainly still ramping up at a decent pace, but you're seeing less in the way of fundamental feature changes between generations now than there were then.

Re: point C, you know that 2008 Dell you're so excited about still being able to use? Sure, it's great you're able to use a 16 year old laptop in 2024. That's only possible because that PC is still technically "modern" according to the mature/stagnant baselines that the Intel/x86 world operates within. Now just imagine it was 16 years ago, 2008, and you're trying to use a 2008 OS to access the 2008 Internet on a 1992 vintage laptop. I'm sorry, but no, Linux isn't going to save you here. If you're lucky that laptop's going to be a 486, but realistically it's more likely to be a 386SX, and Absolutely nothing is going to work. If you split the 17 years between the introduction of the first iPhone in 2007 and today in half, just like we split that 32 years between today and 1992 into two 16 year periods, and chart out the kind of technological leaps there were in mobile devices between 2007 and 2015-ish verses between 2015-ish and now you'll see a very similar kind of technological gulf between the stuff in the first period verses the second. IE, if the first iPhone was a 386 your 2012 iPad is something like a Pentium II, and the last 32 bit IOS devices from 2014-ish were like 32 bit Pentium 4s. An iPad 5th gen or iPad Air2, by contrast, is the equivalent of your Core Duo 2 laptop; trailing edge but, yes, fundamentally different from from the hardware that preceeded them. And that's why they're still viable while your iPad just isn't.

In short, even if Apple *wanted* to put the current iPad OS on your 2012 iPad they couldn't. And, ultimately:

Not at all. And to clear things up that statement wasnt meant to be anything against Apple. Im just not Naive enough to think any company today really cares about thier customers...

Reasonably, how long do you expect a company to support a dingus they're not making a dime on? So far as I'm aware the longest extended warranty they'd sell you in 2012 was three years. In 2012 an iPad cost about as much as a TV set, with those you're probably lucky if the manufacturer's warranty is even a year. And, sure, it sucks that the things that an iPad is built to consume (IE, the Internet and an "app" ecosystem) isn't even remotely as stable and eternal as, well, NTSC broadcast standards were (IE, sure, up as late as the early 2000's you certainly could reasonably expect to roll out the Philco from 1955 and be able to tune in a football game on it. Whether you'd actually enjoy watching it on that verses a newer set is a separate question.) and is therefore certain to become obsolete within (insert random timespan here) after the manufacturer stops coughing up software updates, but... that's life, sorry. If you buy an iPad for $600 and you get six years of use out of it you've paid $8 a month for it. I don't mean to sound elitist, but, well, for a piece of machinery as complex as an iPad a combined hardware purchase+support cost of one farging Starbucks a month doesn't seem that unreasonable.
 
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Well they have to at least a tiny bit, otherwise they would not sell any product (unless its enterprise vendors, hate enterprise vendors)
Sure. They care as much as companies like LG, Samsung, or Dell care. No more no less.
 
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Just a small bit to say. As it happens I've never owned anything from Apple, and I don't ever see that changing. I'm not sure I'd want to deal with a company that is guilty of deliberately slowing down old handsets just so the average idiot would think it's worn out and go buy a new one. https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-67911517

My car is old. It's made in 1996. I can still use it on the roads. I can still get petrol for it. Spare parts are still available. It doesn't have the oh-so unnecessary electronic brain that today's cars have. But it works well enough for me to legally do whatever it is I need to do with it.

If your old phone or computer is still in use, you should be able to try using it or upgrading it. It might not be capable, but you shouldn't be prevented from at least trying. I use Windows 7 for everything here. It still gets updates (I know where to look), it still can do all I need it to. It might not be as fast as today's computers, but at least it's allowed to try. I could even "upgrade" it to Windows 10 if I wanted.

However if a company (any company) goes out of their way to kill your "device", or to prevent you from at least trying to upgrade the OS, or using the internet or whatever, that's when the corporate over-reach is IMO too much. They shouldn't be allowed to do that.

After all, the company that made my car will never do something to break it just because it's not the current model.
 
The only Apple product I personally own, and have willingly paid for, is my 1982-built Apple ][ Europlus. It was a truly honest piece of hardware design. Others may disagree but I think Apple might have gone downhill from there.
 
However if a company (any company) goes out of their way to kill your "device", or to prevent you from at least trying to upgrade the OS, or using the internet or whatever
Who does that? The “prevent using internet” I mean. I tried install windows 8 on my IBM PS/2 Model 50, could not find usb port for the flash drive.
 
Because Apple had locked down the system for no other reason that monetary control there isn't much you can do. I was trying to find a way to jailbreak the device and load some form of android but most of the videos I find are thick indian accents with raging techo music and I really cant follow what they are saying. After two days of trying.. I just gave up. Its way to pointless to exert this much effort towards a device inherently crippled from its designer. Im glad I didn't use any of my own money to buy this thing and feel bad for anyone who has.
There have been two times I know of that anyone got Android booting on iDevices. The original iPhone and maybe the next couple got a method of running early Android since things weren't yet locked down as much, but it died as security improved. Then in 2019 or around then, a group called Project Sandcastle got Android...10? booting on the iPhone 7, but barely anything worked and they quit working on it after releasing a single public build. In theory, all the right chain of exploits exist for the iPad 3 to boot Android and have everything work, but a developer would have to write custom drivers for everything.
Looking it up Apple released the last patch release for iOS 9 (last version it runs) in 2019, which meant that thing was getting official support from the manufacturer for seven years
This is a bit misleading - the 2019 update (iOS 9.3.6) patched a single bug related to GPS, and that was it. Maybe there was one other small thing. iOS 9 itself, the last major update, released in 2016.
But I assure you the ipad was doing EVERYTHING I wanted fine before they stopped it from working. Web pages.. And streaming specifically. So I hear what you are saying on the specs.. But they were working fine until they turned off the ability to do those things.
Apple never "stopped it from working". No switch was flipped. What happened was OS updates ended, and then slowly over the next several years, app developers ended support for iOS 9. The final nail was when xcode dropped support.
Now here's the thing - Apple screwed the iPad 3, but not for the reason you've been saying. They screwed it by updating it to iOS 9 (and really even iOS 8) rather than by not updating it to iOS 10, 11, so on. When iOS 8 released, all Apple devices with the A5 processor (iPhone 4S, iPad 2, iPad 3, iPad Mini 1st Gen, iPod Touch 5) all slowed to a crawl, as the iOS 8 update really needed 1GB of RAM to run well, which the A5 devices didn't have. iOS 9 only made things worse. Attempt at planned obsolescence from Apple by updating them at all? Maybe. Hard to say. But it made them a real pain to use. What they should have done is either optimize iOS 8 better and leave the A5 devices off there, or just leave them on iOS 7.
The benefit of the iOS 8 and 9 updates of course is that it gave A5 devices another couple of years, but they really shouldn't have.

Of course, the ultimate issue is that no 3rd party ROMs could be made for these devices due to how locked down they are. If they had open bootloaders, a whole squadron of developers would be porting Android to them and keeping them alive. There is plenty of objective performance limitations that prevent the iPad 3 from running the latest iOS, but there is no good reason a open version of the iPad 3 running lightweight Android couldn't be used as a music/video streaming device. This is why I dislike Apple hardware.
My HTC Dream died the same fate. It was THE benchmark for running the latest builds of Android on the oldest Android phone and most of the ROMs were either stripped down and featureless or got you as far as the main screen and would crash if you did much else.
The real legend of Android custom ROMs has the HTC HD2. Shipped with Windows Mobile 6.5 and then quickly got an Android port because people got annoyed at how limited WinMo was. It was super easy to flash a custom ROM and you could even boot directly off of microSD. They kept it going for years, up to Android 7.1 believe it or not. Android 5 is about the time the ROMs became more of a curiosity than an actual usable OS though. Android 4.x still ran decent though. They also ported Windows Phone 7, even Windows RT, and Linux.

The Samsung Galaxy S2 (from 2011) became the next legendary device. It only stopped getting the latest versions of Android ported to it around a year ago. Last to really be usable was Android 10.
 
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Um, aren't most mobile phone carriers phasing out 2G and 3G services? Your old phone might serve to shim up an uneven table leg, but is otherwise useless. Some service providers require 4GvoLTE as a minimum ticket for entry.
 
Um, aren't most mobile phone carriers phasing out 2G and 3G services? Your old phone might serve to shim up an uneven table leg, but is otherwise useless. Some service providers require 4GvoLTE as a minimum ticket for entry.
Most phone carriers won't let a device with a custom ROM connect so it's rather moot. The wi-fi portion of the phone would still function
 
Our current iPad is from 2016, it surfs the web and plays my wife's games.

We just swapped out her MacBook Air from 2012 for a new MacBook Air M3. The 256G drive was full and she didn't want to archive any photos or use an external for them, so we got something with 512G and 16G of RAM. We upgraded to the 15" screen, $1700. As I understand it, the MacBook is cheaper than its most direct competitor, the Surface 6. The M3 Air is Very Nice.

She uses that for MS Office, web, photos, and music. I'm keeping the old one for my own use.

My iPhone X lasted 6 years. It, too, finally filled up and I upgraded to a modern 15 this year. If the storage was not full, I probably would have kept it another year or so, even though it was not eligible for OS updates (but they still support it for security).

My iMac is from 2020. 3.8Ghz, 8 Core I7 with 72GB of RAM and screen more akin to a drive in theater. My previous one was a Trash Can Pro from 2013. Before that was a 2006 Mac Pro. We upgraded simply because my wife said "you should get a new computer", so now I have the last of the x86 iMacs. Over the next two years, the compelling force for change will likely be on board AI processing with the new M* series CPUs and AI processors. No rush for that, but I can see that being a reason to upgrade in a couple of years.

My 2006 Mac Pro got obsoleted because it used 32 bit video drivers. I loved my Trash can (utterly silent machine), if my wife hadn't insisted, I'd probably still be running it, but a 10 year old machine shows its long in tooth.

On the PC, the GPU march for games is a driving force in PC systems, the adoption of GPUs for AI is now a path for growth and expansion, plus Apple will likely put more work into their dedicated AI chips for the new world. So, as that front marches on my x86 will fall farther and farther behind. I believe there are new features in the current OS that can not be run on the x86 machines, but I'm not rushing out to upgrade.

With the AI trend, its worth waiting a couple years for them to figure that out again.

Apples fixation of running everything they can locally and not in the Cloud I am fully on board with, and the AI stuff is just going to get more useful.

As much as I'd like the world to stand still and just sit on my computers, it instead marches on, bringing tangible value add. With the new AI space race, the curve will likely get a bit more steep for awhile as we figure it all out.

I've never felt I've got a bad value from Apple.

And this reminds me, I really need to get my 2006 Mac Pro a new home, it's just sitting in the garage.
 
We just swapped out her MacBook Air from 2012 for a new MacBook Air M3. The 256G drive was full and she didn't want to archive any photos or use an external for them, so we got something with 512G and 16G of RAM
I believe the storage in the 2012 MacBook Air is upgradeable? There are plenty of other reasons to upgrade, but the storage problem could be fixed. I'd never buy a Mac with 512GB nowadays though - it's soldered down now and 512GB may be enough for your wife right now, but it's not a whole lot anymore. What I hate is how much Apple is able to price-gouge higher storage tiers because no one is able to upgrade them anymore. Plus, the laptop is junk when the SSD wears out.
 
My wife has a 2 year old iPad and loves it as well as her 13 phone and apple watch. The only Apple anything that I have is 2 turners for some tv's because she likes them.
 
Most phone carriers won't let a device with a custom ROM connect so it's rather moot. The wi-fi portion of the phone would still function
13 years ago, how many mobile phones had WiFi capabilities (don't forget the aspect of security protocols)? What's the purpose of a telephone, mobile or otherwise? If you can't make and receive calls, the phone is junk or a collector's item.

Or, consider the drain spade that I purchased from the local hardware store. It has a "lifetime warranty". So, after, a couple of years of use digging into hard clay, the blade fractured. The manufacturer denied my claim, saying that, in its opinion, it had served a full service life.

On the other hand, a Le Creuset dutch oven developed a chip in the porcelain coating after 30 years of service. LC didn't so much as blink; they sent me a new one, even paying shipping. All it took was an email and a photo.

So what am I saying here? Apple and most other vendors are adopting the mobile phone model--that your purchase is only good for the time chosen to support it. At time of purchase, of course, the vendor will not specify what that period is--6 months or 16 years. An original iPhone probably falls under the "junk" category.
 
13 years ago, how many mobile phones had WiFi capabilities
Many I think. The smartphone and blackberry were already very popular. I remember so many people had blackberry in 2000 or 2001 where I worked. Did those have wireless?

I knew a bunch of people who had the sidekick. As it goes to flip-phones.. I dont remember. I really loved my Razr2 ( I think I had two) But I dont recall too much about it anymore as it was 2008 or 9 when I got a smart phone.
 
I believe the storage in the 2012 MacBook Air is upgradeable?
Oh, apparently it is! I honestly didn't really consider that.

Mac with 512GB nowadays though - it's soldered down now and 512GB may be enough for your wife right now, but it's not a whole lot anymore.
Indeed, it's a ticking bomb, but time will tell. I have 4000+ photos on my phone, "cuz I can", essentially. At some point, it will run out, but I can put that decision off for the time being.

What I hate is how much Apple is able to price-gouge higher storage tiers because no one is able to upgrade them anymore.
Indeed.

I get good value from Apple, but I'll never defend their storage prices.

With the nascent "right to repair" movement slowing gaining momentum, a sea change may be happening in this area in the next few years.

I'm content with my computer purchase velocity, and the new AI era will Change Things, no doubt.
 
, and the new AI era will Change Things, no doubt.
Indeed. More and more people will needlessly keep talking about it.. ad nauseam.

With the nascent "right to repair" movement slowing gaining momentum, a sea change may be happening in this area in the next few years.
I certainly hope so. It will only be good for the entire consumer market if it gains a foothold.
 
On the other hand, a Le Creuset dutch oven developed a chip in the porcelain coating after 30 years of service. LC didn't so much as blink; they sent me a new one, even paying shipping. All it took was an email and a photo.
For the price people pay for a chunk of iron, I should certainly hope so. Even Apple doesn't charge 3+X as much.

We're quite content with our enameled Loge dutch oven.
 
For the price people pay for a chunk of iron, I should certainly hope so. Even Apple doesn't charge 3+X as much.

We're quite content with our enameled Loge dutch oven.
I bought my Wife the largest (8 Qt) Martha Stewart collection dutch oven from Macy's. Its held up amazingly from all its use. The cobalt blue enamel hasn't chipped or cracked. It was a gamble but a great purchase in the end.

When it comes to standard pots and pans I only cook with cast iron, stainless, or copper.. And I can always find them second hand for practically nothing. Reason being some folks dont know how to remove scorching or staining using vinegar and even if they look used an gross you can usually get them looking great again with a little work.
 
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